Cochin Shipyard Ltd

NSE:COCHINSHIP

Q1-2026 Earnings Call

[Operator]

Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to the Q1 FY '26 Results Conference Call of Cochin Shipyard Limited, hosted by Kirin Advisors Private Limited. [Operator Instructions] Please note that this conference is being recorded and scheduled for 1 hour. I would now like to hand the conference over to Ms. Chandni. Thank you, and over to you, ma'am.

[Chandni Chande, analyst]

Thank you. On behalf of Kirin Advisors, I welcome you all to the conference call of Cochin Shipyard Limited. From management team, we have Shri Madhu S. Nair, Chairman and Managing Director; Shri Jose V. J., Director of Finance; Shri Rajesh Gopalakrishnan, Executive Director, Ship Repair; Shri Harikrishnan S., Executive Director, Shipbuilding; Shri Shiraz V. P., Chief General Manager, Planning and Project Management; Shri Shibu John, General Manager, Finance; Shri Vulli Haranath, Deputy General Manager and EA to CMD; and Shri Syamkamal N., Company Secretary. Now I hand over the call to Shri Madhu Nair. Over to you, sir.

[Madhu Nair, executive]

Good evening, everyone, and welcome to the first quarter results conference call of Cochin Shipyard Limited for the financial year 2025-'26. The people presented in this call from the Cochin Shipyard Limited side has already been mentioned. Let me briefly share the highlights of the first quarter. During this quarter, CSL secured new orders, including two 70-ton Bollard Pull Tugs from Messrs. Polestar Maritime Limited and a Luxury River Cruise vessel from Heritage River Cruise journey through the Hooghly Cochin Shipyard Limited.

On the delivery side, we handled over the 19th electric hybrid water metro boat to Kochi Metro and Udupi CSL delivered its first dry cargo vessel to the European client. We also signed 2 important MOUs that will strengthen our global collaboration. with Drydocks World, UAE. MOU was signed to explore the development of ship repair clusters at Kochi and Vadinar. With HD KSOE of South Korea, we intend to jointly explore new shipbuilding opportunities, share technical expertise and work together to scale up productivity, capacity utilization and workforce skills. These partnerships will help us position India more strongly in the global market and will help to achieve the targets envisioned in the Maritime India Vision 2030 and the Maritime Amrit Kaal Vision 2047 documents.

I'm also pleased to report that both our major capital projects, namely the new dry dock and the international ship repair facility, ISRF, have been completed and are now operational. This marks an important step in expanding our capabilities and strengthening our long-term growth prospects. Turning to the financial performance. We reported a turnover of INR 1,068.59 crores in Q1, up from INR 771.47 crores in the same quarter last year. Profit before tax was INR 249.54 crores compared with INR 235.82 crores last year. And profit after tax rose to INR 187.82 crores from INR 174.23 crores. Our EBITDA margin for the quarter stood at 28% and PAT margin at 18%.

These results reflect steady growth and operational strength. Our order book remains good at about INR 21,000 crores. This includes ship repair order book also of approximately INR 1,500 crores. The balance out of the INR 21,100 crores is the shipbuilding order book, which is about INR 19,600 crores across 75 vessels in the Kochi facility, the Udupi CSL and the Hooghly CSL. Out of the 75 vessels on order, 25 vessels are in design and construction stage that is in the early stages. 37 are on the fabrication and assembly stages, which is in the mid stages of the shipbuilding cycle and 13 vessels have been launched and are in advanced stages of completion.

This concludes my brief overview of the first quarter. We value your trust and continued support. And with that, we are happy to have questions from our investors and from all of you. We are happy to take these questions. Thank you.

[Operator]

[Operator Instructions] The first question comes from the line of Sucrit Patil from Eyesight Fintrade.

[Sucrit Patil, analyst]

I have 2 questions. My first question is to Mr. Madhu Nair and second is to Mr. Jose. Mr. Nair, so just touching base on your previous calls, I have a forward-looking question. In the last few calls, you spoke about defense exports, green vessels and using modular construction for faster shipbuilding. Now that the revenue has grown considerably on the positive side this quarter, are you planning to build a full digital shipyard model where AI and smart sensors and modular systems will work together to reduce the build time and improve the global competitiveness. Is there a road map to make Cochin Shipyard a global center for smart label manufacturing?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

See, we will invest into modern systems, especially on the engineering side. On the production side also, there would be digital tools and gadgets being adopted. But as you pointed out, we are not currently talking about moving entirely into a smart shipyard kind of a configuration. We will take facets out of what is smart, but we will not be a fully fly-by-wire kind of smart shipyard. That is not on the anvil. But yes, we will adopt technology wherever it is required.

[Sucrit Patil, analyst]

Okay. Great. And my follow-up question is to Mr. Jose. I believe he's on the call today.

[V. Jose, executive]

Yes, I'm there. I'm there. Go ahead.

[Sucrit Patil, analyst]

Go ahead. Yes, sir. So I just want to understand from a financial point of view, as Cochin Shipyard is trying to invest in new tech, build modular yards and export plant, how do you decide where to spend first? Like is there a system that helps you balance short-term profit with long-term growth? I just want to understand how you approach the whole thing.

[V. Jose, executive]

See, we have a long-term plan, which is 2030 and 2047, based on which we have set certain priorities, based on the sectors in which we have to invest. So based on that, we have a long-term investment plan. Accordingly, we will do that based on the merits of each case.

[Operator]

The next question comes from the line of Deepak Krishnan from Kotak Institutional Equities.

[Deepak Krishnan, analyst]

Yes. Sir, I just wanted to understand the HD KSOE announcements, the dry docks announcements as well as sort of -- other sort of announcements with Maersk. Each of these 3, how -- at what stage are we in terms of getting anything on the ground? Are we looking at building a separate shipyard with HD? Or -- and in terms of medium-term, what could potentially be the revenue potential that could kind of come through from all of these ventures? What are we plan to do, by when and what is the sort of revenue that we are looking at?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

See, with HD KSOE, we are talking largely shipbuilding and that to merchant shipbuilding. So if you are asking for a time line for such things, we will start with engagement from our Cochin facility. You are aware that in the Cochin facility, we have completed a new large dry dock, which is a 310-meter large dry dock. So the initial approach would be to make sure that, that dry dock is leveraged to its optimal or its best capacities, for which what we are thinking at this stage would be to create additional fabrication capacities aligning with HD KSOE's thought process and using those fabrication, that fresh fabrication capacities, to build more vessels in a much more competitive time frame from this new dry dock.

So the dry dock is already completed. It is already operational, but to use that dry dock to build more vessels in more competitive framework. So this is HD KSOE's core engagement. Along with it, naturally, there will be skill sets improvement, there will be training improvement, there is going to be engineering cooperation. So it's actually a comprehensive -- I'm using the word comprehensive and long term. So it's a comprehensive long-term association with HD KSOE on the shipbuilding side.

With the Drydocks World, Dubai, it is actually ship repair, which is a core focus. It could also encompass other areas, but then it is ship repair to start up with. And the intent is, again, long term. As you are aware, Drydocks World is one of the most respected ship repair and specialist shipbuilding organizations in the Middle East. So with them, the intent is to leverage the newly completed international ship repair facility at Kochin to -- again to start off with so that the working relations and the methodologies are strengthened.

And once we get into that, we have also discussed further expansion of that cooperation. But again, that would be ship repair at the initial stages. Overall, we are talking about anything between 3 to 5 years for these things to actually mature and come. Certain things, the ship repair part could happen in the next 1.5, 2 years onwards. The shipbuilding part, as you are fully aware, will take a little bit more time. But largely, we are talking about a horizon of around 3 to 5 years for these things to fructify. So the important part to note here is both these organizations, HD KSOE is the #1 -- as we are speaking, the #1 shipbuilding group in the world from Korea and Drydocks World, Dubai, is potentially one of the most reputed groups in the world from Middle East.

So these relationships -- again, I use the word long term. These relationships are strategic in nature, pure business-driven and the teaming up is working very well. That is all I can say at this stage. I'm not in a position to paint any financial figures out of both these associations at this stage, but these are very critical, very important and with a long-term view for our organization and from HD KSOE and Drydocks World point of view. You also touched upon the Maersk MOU. This is, again, multiple fronts, start of ship repair and people skilling.

There could also be -- potentially at a later stage, there could also be shipbuilding. But initially, we would be happy to target to get the ball rolling this calendar -- this financial year, trying to get one vessel of Maersk to be repaired in our ship repair facility at Cochin. Again, I will not want to paint financial figures on to this. But again, Maersk being one of the most leading shipping companies in the world, we take pride in this association.

[Deepak Krishnan, analyst]

Sure, sir. Maybe just wanted to understand on the order pipeline given on this slide, INR 2.2 trillion out of that INR 1.29 trillion is at RFI stage for the defense side and the INR 65,000 crores on the commercial front. In this context, also I wanted to understand where are we in terms of IAC-2, any development since the last earnings call that we've had. So the pipeline for both defense, commercial and IAC, if you could give any updates on all of those?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

See, the pipeline on the defense -- see, what we wanted to convey is that there is enough and there's a strong order pipeline. There are a few projects which has already crossed the bidding stage, and we have bid against that. There are others in the interim stage at the RFI stage, and there will be more to come. All we wanted to say is that there is enough from the defense side that is coming in.

On the commercial side, what we have projected is we are not talking whatever is there in the world, that kind of assessment we feel does not have a meaning for us, but what Cochin Shipyard is looking at where there have been some form of interactions and some thought process, that is what we are painting here. Both looks good. So we will run our defense establishment also strongly. We will run our commercial establishment also strongly, and we feel the pipeline is good for that. There was a third point which was asked...

[Deepak Krishnan, analyst]

The IAC-2.

[Madhu Nair, executive]

IAC-2, again, we are not in a position to convey anything. There is -- I can say that there are no fresh developments to report. That is all I can say. But I think we are hopeful, but we are not in a position to hazard a guess on the time lines.

[Deepak Krishnan, analyst]

Sir, maybe if I can just squeeze one question. Ship repair, we have seen very strong margins. I think it's a function of both the 2 IACs, Vikrant and Vikramaditya under EP requirements are getting executed. Now that those orders are out, how are we looking at, say, overall margins for the year? And specifically, any comments on the 2 segments between shipbuilding and ship repair? How are we looking at margin profile for FY '26?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

Jose, you want to...

[V. Jose, executive]

Yes. Ship repair last year, as you rightly said, there were 2 aircraft carriers. So we may not have that much margin coming from ship repair this year. Still ship repair will do a decent performance this year, around -- maybe around INR 1,500 crores level, but the margin may not be at the level of what you have seen last year.

[Deepak Krishnan, analyst]

And sir, on shipbuilding?

[V. Jose, executive]

Shipbuilding also the margin -- as you rightly said that the shipbuilding margin is not at the level of ship repair. It is around 10 to 12 percentage normally. So that kind of margin we can expect from shipbuilding also.

[Madhu Nair, executive]

So on an overall PAT levels, we would guide...

[V. Jose, executive]

Around 15% on a PAT margin level.

[Operator]

[Operator Instructions] The next question comes from the line of Dhiraj Dave from Samvad Financial Services LLP.

[Dhiraj Dave, analyst]

My first question is basically on both these JVs, do we expect further CapEx to be incurred or the new [Technical Difficulty].

[Madhu Nair, executive]

You're not coming fully clear. Can you get this better?

[V. Jose, executive]

He was asking the two JVs, whether it will have more CapEx from CSL side?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

See, on the HD KSOE side, as we are moving forward, there will be CapEx in, as I said, new [Technical Difficulty] facilities. We are discussing this. We are not in a position to comment at this stage, but there will be more CapEx. On the Drydocks World side, we are already having the ship repair facility with a shiplift and 6 workstations already completed. So for that, there won't be further CapEx. But teaming up with Drydocks World, when we expand further the business, we will look at CapEx. And whether it's CSL or whether it would be together, these are early days. We may not be able to comment on it, but it will call for further investments given the opportunity.

[Dhiraj Dave, analyst]

And my -- one suggestion from my side is when you give us the presentation, please try to include order movement also over a period because basically, we get like all the sales figures and everything. But since it's a material is -- at least whatever order in hand or order pipeline, we show that also over quarter or over year, whatever is convenient and what you want to communicate, that will help us. It gives us confidence. Order in hand, whatever we are executing -- order book.

[Madhu Nair, executive]

Order book has been given in the slide, just...

[Dhiraj Dave, analyst]

Yes, yes, I know, but it's basically that order book of like INR 2 lakh crores. Now last year, it was INR 150,000 crores or INR 250,000 crores. So what my suggestion would be that at least over a year, if you can compare, it helps us to...

[Madhu Nair, executive]

Okay. Okay. Noted.

[Operator]

The next question comes from the line of Naman Jain with Kotak Institutional Equities.

[Naman Jain, analyst]

Sir, a couple of questions. One is you gave the PAT guidance of 15%. If possible, can you also give top line growth guidance for the year?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

Top line, we -- for the current year from where we were last year, we consider 14 to 15 percentage top line growth.

[Naman Jain, analyst]

Okay. Okay. And secondly, sir, on the 2 new facilities which you have created, obviously, the ISRF will be used at a faster pace from our new MOU as far as what I've understood. What sort of asset turn or maximum -- because obviously, this is the first facility which you'll use, right? So what is the top line that you can potentially generate from here before we move on to additional CapEx as we scale up our ship repairing business?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

Yes. See, this is the ISRF. We hope we should be able to get into about -- in about the initial 18 to 24 months, we should go to about INR 250 crores of extra revenue. And then full-blown condition, we go to about INR 600-plus crores.

[Naman Jain, analyst]

Okay. And similarly, sir, if you can share something on the new dry dock also, if possible, that will be very helpful.

[Madhu Nair, executive]

That's a little bit difficult to decipher it that way because that gets reflected in the overall top line. You can't -- because shipbuilding, you can't exactly put it into one facility because dry dock does not produce ships. The overall ecosystem produces the ships. Ship repair, I can give much more with clarity.

[Naman Jain, analyst]

Correct. And lastly, sir, if you can share something as a basis the current facility we have, right, and the current revenue we are generating from shipbuilding, how much more CapEx we need, let's say, if you want to double our revenue size for shipbuilding eventually in 4, 5 years, given we are already anyways growing at 14%, 15%? So we'll double likely in 5 years. So what more CapEx will we need, if you have some estimate?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

See, we have -- in various discussions earlier, we have said by about 2030, '31, somewhere around that period, we should, as we said, double and -- double our turnover kind of level, for which we may not need too much CapEx as we are -- because we have already completed almost INR 3,250 crores of CapEx cycle across the 2 facilities and some of our subsidiaries. So that has been done over the last, say, about 7 years. That is completed.

Going beyond that double figure, which is say something INR 10,000 crores, INR 11,000 crores, INR 12,000 crores in about 2030, '31. Crossing that threshold and moving forward is where we'll invest the CapEx now because any CapEx, which we are investing now, will take some time to turn around and shipbuilding facilities are not very easy to build up. It takes time. So we are talking about that CapEx, which we will invest over the next, let's say, 5 years or so, and you will see the outcomes of that coming beyond 2030 kind of a requirement.

[Naman Jain, analyst]

So right now -- so from now on, we'll be generating free cash primarily from our existing facility? Got it.

[Madhu Nair, executive]

This is the intent.

[Operator]

[Operator Instructions] The next question comes from the line of Akhilesh Gupta, an individual investor.

[Akhilesh Gupta]

First of all, congratulations on a good set of numbers. So I just wanted to know the increased Maritime Development Fund that the government has announced around INR 70,000 crores. How much of it are we going to like tap on to?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

See the Maritime Development Fund, the contours have not come in fully in public domain, but the Maritime Development Fund is essentially a fund for multiple uses. It will help fund ship owners to place orders for shipbuilding in India. It will support in case an organization like Cochin Shipyard Limited wants to -- there could be an equity part in it, there could be a debt part in it. So funding could be available from the Maritime Development Fund, but it is essentially a pool. It's a specialist maritime financial pool.

We should take it at that point. It's not a grant from the government. It is not just money which is -- what should we say, like, it's not available -- it's not just available as a freebie kind of a thing. That is not what we are talking. But it will be -- it will take into account the specific nature of requirements in the shipbuilding and the shipping industry. It's not just for shipbuilding. It's also for shipping. So as I said, if -- for example, if we need investments which are long term in nature and we need a part of that as equity, potentially the MDF could come in as an equity partner. The MDF could come in as a loan at an affordable rate. So we are not in a position to say exact figures on this, but we are factoring in the MDF into our discussions.

[Operator]

The next question comes from the line of Dhanraj Tolani, an individual investor.

[Dhanraj Tolani]

I just wanted to know like what is the current utilization rate of your, I would say, new dry dock or ISRF facility?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

The new ISRF, as we are speaking, we have -- Rajesh, how many vessels? 14 vessels?

[Rajesh Gopalakrishnan, executive]

14 vessels.

[Madhu Nair, executive]

14 vessels are under various stages of repair in the ISRF. When we say this, we say that the total strength of ISRF is 82 ships per year, that is what we are talking. We currently have 14 vessels at ISRF. And on the new dry dock, we are not in a position to talk about the utilization tractor kind of a thing. It's normally talked about in dock days. But right now, there are 2 -- there are 3 vessels being built in the dock. And there will be one dredger, which will come in for ship repair. So it's actually being utilized to the full right now, but we are not probably in a position to give you a percentage kind of a thing at this stage.

[Operator]

Does that answer your question, Dhanraj? Dhanraj, are you there?

[Dhanraj Tolani]

Yes, yes. So do we have any plans to expand into offshore renewables or allied...

[Madhu Nair, executive]

Plans to expand?

[Dhanraj Tolani]

Sorry?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

I didn't get that question.

[Dhanraj Tolani]

Do we have any plans to expand to offshore renewables or allied segment?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

Not right away.

[Dhanraj Tolani]

Okay. Okay. And currently, if we -- like given the current order book, so what revenue growth do we expect in FY '26?

[V. Jose, executive]

Revenue growth FY '26?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

Revenue growth FY '26, as I said, 14 to 15 percentage.

[Dhanraj Tolani]

Okay. And also, like how do you balance between domestic projects and higher-margin international commercial projects? So how do you see that?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

See, this depends on -- we have given our order book in the presentation. So we have projects on hand, both from the defense, which is all domestic and commercial -- we have domestic. Commercial, we have export. So it's a balance between this, and it's from a business point of view and it's from an infrastructure point of view. So I think if you can just have a look at the order book position, which we have presented, you'll get a fair feel of what we are trying to do.

[Dhanraj Tolani]

So are we taking any steps to upscale our workforce for that or...

[Madhu Nair, executive]

Yes, yes. Very much. We are continuously -- the multiple levels of skilling for the workmen. There are capability and capacity development for the officers and the supervisors. So that's an ongoing process, and we are putting in quite some efforts in that direction.

[Operator]

[Operator Instructions] The next question comes from the line of Priyal Jain from Green Capital.

[Unknown Analyst]

Yes. So I'm new to the company and just wanted to understand a few things. Can you like give me a breakdown of the profitability profile across your like domestic, commercial and export orders?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

We have put in a few details in the presentation that's already uploaded, would it be good because that's too general and too large a question to be answered pointedly. But if you have a few pointed questions, maybe we'll be able to answer it. Otherwise, it's going to be difficult to -- because it's very general what you have asked.

[Unknown Analyst]

Okay. A few more questions, if you can give me about a working capital requirement for such large order pipeline?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

Can we request you to send in your most important questions by e-mail to Company Secretary, we'll respond to it.

[Unknown Analyst]

Yes, sure, sir. If you can give me a few pointers like what opportunities do you see in India's defense push? And how is company placed to benefit?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

Overall, the company is today confident and it's a robust company from an operational point of view and from a financial point of view. We are cautious and optimistic both at the same time because that has been our DNA. We are aggressive at the same time, conservative. So we take that path, which we think keeps us going strong into the future. From an overall point of view -- from a country's point of view, the country is very strongly promoting shipbuilding as a mainstay of the Indian industry. It has never been this supportive -- the government policies have never been this supportive.

So we are also very clearly in this whole ecosystem, using the opportunities. The global major players are looking at India as a potential collaborator. Cochin Shipyard is one of the most sought-after companies by the global partners. And for us also, we are sensing that the opportunity in India is good to do these global partnerships. So overall, we feel good. The company today, where it is, it looks good and give it a 5-year horizon, give it a 10-year horizon, both looks good. So this is what I can say.

And we have generally guided -- as I said, this particular financial year, we can guide a top line growth of 14 to 15 percentage. But generally, we say a guidance of 10 to 12 percentage, which is what we have seen in this industry. This industry has got a cyclical nature. Factoring all of those, we are confident to guide a 10- to 12-year growth prospects over the next 5 to 10 years or more. So would that answer your question in general?

[Unknown Analyst]

Yes. Fair enough, sir. Sir, just one more question. Like how should investors interpret the shift in revenue mix between shipbuilding and repair?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

I would desist from answer. That is something which people like you should advise them. We -- our job is to run the company transparently, trustfully and with credibility. How the investors have to look into investing, we leave it to the market.

[Unknown Analyst]

Also, I told you earlier that I'm new to the company, like seeing the current momentum, where I can see you and like Cochin Shipyard in the next 5 years?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

Somewhere around double this turnover, strong company and very strongly alive and kicking.

[Operator]

[Operator Instructions] The next question comes from the line of Aditi Roy, an individual investor.

[Aditi Roy]

What is your strategy to build a recurring revenue streams beyond project build, shipbuilding?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

Can you repeat that question once again?

[Aditi Roy]

Sir. What is your strategy to build recurring revenue streams beyond project build, shipbuilding?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

See, we are in shipbuilding and ship repair. Essentially, the company is in shipbuilding and ship repair. Shipbuilding and ship repair, the current method and the market is -- shipbuilding, we do not build to stock. We build -- it's an EPC business. So we scout for orders. We look at the segments that is available, and we pick up what is available and from amongst what is available, what is the best suited for us. This is in shipbuilding.

Ship repair is a continually flowing market. There are always ship repair requirements. And it's a business where the company is continuously in connect and touch with the major shipowners. So it's a continual business where we look at requirements over the next -- anywhere within 3 months to the next year, 1.5 years kind of future business. So the business has got its own nuances, and we follow those nuances because essentially, this is all stemming from shipping, which is a mother industry for this.

[Aditi Roy]

And sir, my next question is, how significant are exports as a part of your long-term growth strategy?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

Exports are very important as part of our long-term strategy because we are focused on specialist vessel exports into Europe. And we are also now along with potential partners like HD KSOE from Korea. We are looking at the merchant vessel export segment also. So exports is very important in our scheme of things, on the commercial shipbuilding side. If you have looked at our figures, you will see that we are having a defense shipbuilding part, and we are having a commercial shipbuilding part. The defense shipbuilding, as we are speaking, it is only for the Indian Navy. So it is 100% Indian. But the commercial shipbuilding, we will very strongly focus on the export business also.

[Aditi Roy]

I have one last question. What cost pressure are you facing in, say, equipment or manpower? And how are they being managed?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

Again, as I said, we are not building to stock. It is actually we bid for projects. And once the project comes in, then we tap our supply chain. So we are exposed only between the bidding stage until the construction phase. Over the years, we have developed a fair bit of experience to tide over such situations. And largely at the bidding stage, we consider the current market pricing to be passed on into the -- to the clients. And that is how the market also takes it normally.

[Operator]

[Operator Instructions] The next question comes from the line of Harsh Shah from [ Shree PMS ].

[Unknown Analyst]

Sir, if you could throw some light on the government's focus on the upcoming shipbuilding clusters across the country. How will that affect the industry in general and our company to be very specific, sir?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

See, the government of India is putting an emphasis on developing shipbuilding as a large industry. From multiple points of view, from strategic importance point of view, from country's industrial infrastructure point of view, the requirement to build more ships for the domestic market also in India and from a large-scale employment generator point of view. And from a point that this can -- this is an industry which turns up a lot of ancillary industries and MSMEs.

So from that point of view, the government is very focused. The government is looking at this by development of multiple clusters across various Indian coastal states. The central government, along with the states are trying to work on this. At this stage, the initial scouting of the locations, the initial policy and support systems, which between the central government and largely with the state governments, that is being presented. Multiple interests are looking at this, but it is too early days to comment on how exactly these clusters will come up. But it is very gratifying to note that most of the coastal states, Odisha, Andhra Pradesh, Maharashtra, Gujarat and Tamil Nadu to mention specifically, are very keenly looking at this.

How it will impact the market? The expectation is that the Indian shipbuilding industry will have significant growth into the future. What opportunities and what challenges it opens up, I can't say for sure. But for sure, one thing is clear that the shipbuilding industry is going to be much more stronger under the directions of the central government. That is all we can say. And we will see potential foreign players, collaborations, especially countries like Korea and Japan potentially investing into some of these clusters in India.

[Operator]

[Operator Instructions] The next question comes from the line of Rupam Jaiswal from Investwell Agents.

[Rupam Jaiswal, analyst]

Sir, I wanted to know about the repair number. Like -- you said like in this financial year, how much are we going to do in terms of ship repairing? And last year, you had 2 aircraft carriers. So is this -- like the repair finished?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

Yes. Last year, we had the aircraft carrier. So that is why that figure was pretty good. This year, still, we are expecting to do fairly good figures. So we are expecting to do about INR 1,500 crores of ship repair revenue in FY '26. So we -- if you have seen our figures, we have grown from about INR 1,000 crores to INR 1,875 crores, which was a little bit of a one-off because of the aircraft carrier repair. But when compared with that, we hope to do good this year also at about INR 1,500 crores.

[Rupam Jaiswal, analyst]

Okay, sir. And one more thing, sir. You -- like Cochin Shipyard has a master agreement with U.S. Navy. So are we expecting any ships from them in terms of repairs?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

We have the master ship repair agreement with the U.S. Navy. There are discussions ongoing, but we are probably not in a position to comment. We haven't concluded any ship repair engagement with them as of today. That is all I can say.

[Rupam Jaiswal, analyst]

Sir, are we expecting that we will receive any ships for the repairs...

[Madhu Nair, executive]

We are working towards it. Being the U.S. Navy and being an MSRA, we will not be able to comment, but we are working towards it.

[Rupam Jaiswal, analyst]

Okay. And one more thing, sir. In terms of shipbuilding, like what's the capacity in terms of how many ships can we build in terms of commercial or in terms of defense? Like what's the capacity and number of ships that can be built consequently?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

That's a slightly difficult question to answer because number of ships -- because it depends on the size and scale of the ship, the complexity of the vessel. So we normally don't talk about a number. See, as we are speaking today, within the group, that is within Cochin Shipyard, Kochi unit, Udupi CSL and Hooghly CSL, there are 75 vessels, but you'll have to measure these vessels. They are of different sizes and scales, but there are 75 vessels under contract.

And in our presentation, we have seen -- when we say under contract, what is physically being constructed is 37 plus 13. That is 50 numbers, are under various stages of construction, 25 are under design and engineering stage. So it is very difficult to say what is your number of vessels to be constructed. We would rather request you to look at the overall financial figure of Cochin Shipyard as an indicator of what we can actually build.

[Rupam Jaiswal, analyst]

Okay, sir. And one more thing, sir, in terms of commercial shipbuilding, like you were very optimistic in the types of order you will be getting and you are bidding for it also. So do we have the design and technology like for the Panamax or the SSR like those kind of ships, which are more of for carrying LPG or crude oil? Are we -- do we have the technology or the design for [indiscernible] to builds those ships?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

Typically like -- there are a fair bit of capabilities available in India, but it is also a measure of the market and what the market would need. So what the client would need? Do they need -- because an Indian design ship or a Cochin Shipyard design ship probably is being designed for the first time or the experience or the proof in the market is yet to come. So there may be clients who may want to look at ships which are in the market for, what I call, proven designs or with some proven design houses.

So we will look at both options. But largely, we will look at teaming up with international players to build merchant vessels. There would be projects which we'll handle in India also within Cochin Shipyard's design pros or within the design establishments in India in the private sector space.

[Rupam Jaiswal, analyst]

Okay, sir. And sir, lastly -- just the last question. As per I remember, like we were building on dredger for Dredging Corporation of India. So are we completed that project and are we delivered it?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

It is not yet completed. In fact, we are facing some challenges in the delivery time lines on that vessel. But in the next 1 month, we are launching that vessel. That vessel is at advanced stages of construction. So we'll launch the vessel. That means the vessel will be in water in the next about a month. And thereafter, it will take a few months for us to get it delivered to the client.

[Operator]

[Operator Instructions] The next question comes from the line of Sachin Maniar with 3P Investment Managers.

[Sachin Maniar, analyst]

Yes. My first question is on the order book of the defense for INR 13,700 crores. Can you give the rough breakup for the larger platforms?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

INR 13,700 crores 14 vessels spread across 2 projects. One project is in ASW corvette, which is about -- just a minute, about INR 3,700 crores unexecuted orders. And the remaining part of INR 13,700 crores is a project called the next-generation missile vessels. That is big ships.

[Operator]

Does that answer your question, Sachin?

[Sachin Maniar, analyst]

Yes. And my second question is, sir, on the defense order pipeline, which you have shown in the PPT of almost INR 220,000 crores. Can you give me a few of the rough larger platforms we have been included here in the bid stage, RFP stage and RFI stage?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

There are 2 projects -- just a minute. There are 2 projects worth about INR 10,000 crores for which bids have been submitted. There are a few small projects about INR 1,000 crores, which are in the RFP stage. And getting into the RFI stage, there are -- the large projects are what is the MCMV, the mine countermeasures vessel, the P-17 Bravo vessel, the LPD. Those are the vessels that the RFI or yet to be RFP stage.

[Sachin Maniar, analyst]

Sir, which is this INR 10,000 crore order, which 2 projects -- which are these 2 projects?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

There's -- one is with the Coast Guard. This is the next-generation fast patrol vessels. How many vessels? That was...

[Unknown Executive]

18.

[Madhu Nair, executive]

18 vessels for the Coast Guard. And then there's this next-generation survey vessels for the Indian Navy.

[Operator]

[Operator Instructions] The next question comes from the line of Harsh from Toro Wealth Managers LLP.

[Unknown Analyst]

I wanted to understand that in FY '24, we had higher EBITDA margins of almost 24%. And right now, we are close to 19%. Even in last year end, we are expecting it to be lower because of the product mix. So is there a change in mix versus FY '24 as well when we had clocked higher margins?

[V. Jose, executive]

See, the combined EBITDA for the Q1 is around 28% -- the EBITDA for the company for the Q1 is 28%.

[Unknown Analyst]

Correct. It's 24% for Q1, but we are guiding that it would be lower, right, for the entire year?

[V. Jose, executive]

Yes, yes. That -- yes, correct. Correct.

[Unknown Analyst]

So I'm just trying to compare at a blended level, we would be lower, say, around 20%, 22% versus blended, if I have to take a number from FY '24 numbers. I was just trying to understand that was there a difference in the product mix versus a couple of years before as well? Because last year, you mentioned that there was this order which was there, which will not be this year. Just want to try to understand, is there a product mix changing across the years, which is fluctuating the margins?

[V. Jose, executive]

Yes. See, the year before, we had the aircraft carrier building. The last year, we had the aircraft carrier repair also. So the both -- the margin was slightly higher side. But this year, we don't have such large projects. So the EBITDA will be around 20 percentage, that's what we guide overall.

[Unknown Analyst]

Overall Okay. And do we expect to get these aircraft orders again in future?

[Madhu Nair, executive]

The ship repair ones will come. It's a cycle through which the ship repair ones will come. The shipbuilding, as we discussed, the next aircraft carrier, we are not in a position to discuss at this stage because we hope it will come, but time lines, we are not in a position to talk.

[Operator]

Ladies and gentlemen, that was the last question for today. I would now like to hand the conference over to Ms. Chande for closing remarks.

[Chandni Chande, analyst]

[Technical Difficulty] queries, you can write to us at [email protected]. Once again, thank you for joining the call. Thank you everyone.

[Madhu Nair, executive]

Thank you.

[Operator]

Ladies and gentlemen, on behalf of Kirin Advisors Private Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines.