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Havila Kystruten AS
OSE:HKY
Havila Kystruten AS
OSE:HKY
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Good morning, ladies and gentlemen, and a warm welcome to today's earnings call of the Havila Kystruten AS following the publication of the Q3 figures of 2024 yesterday. We're delighted to welcome CEO, Bent Martini; and CFO, Aleksander Røynesdal. So the gentlemen will speak shortly and guide us through the presentation and the results. [Operator Instructions]
So having said this, Bent, the stage is yours.
Thanks a lot, Sarah. Welcome to our quarterly presentation of the third quarter of 2024. Next slide, please.
Yes. Just to repeat for those that haven't seen this before. Of course, we see ourselves -- our core mission is to secure sustainable operations, of course, profitable operations. We do have, at least what we think ourselves, the most environmentally friendly and the most modern vessels operating on the Norwegian coast and are delivering on kind of environmental-friendly operations. Next slide, please.
Some business highlights from third quarter. We have a very positive development in all core KPIs, also compared to same quarter last year. The improved occupancy, 78% compared to last year, is high in this period of year. We have higher average cabin rate and have also been able to increase the onboard spend per passenger night, which we will continue doing into both fourth quarter and next year.
Our cost and the cost increases reflects higher occupancy and the activity, so to speak. And we are quite happy with delivering third quarter with a very positive EBITDA compared to same quarter last year, which was a minus result. We have a positive NOK 128 million this quarter.
And we continue delivering on the performance. The Net Promoter Score and the customers are very satisfied with the product. And of course, keeping the customers satisfied, we also improved or at least helped improving the business going forward. And we have a high interest in traveling with Havila Kystruten. It looks very positive, once it is -- for the third quarter but also for the fourth quarter, and also going into next year. Next, please.
And of course, having been recognized for what we are doing is fantastic for everyone working in the company. Just a couple of weeks ago, we received the Wave Awards for the Best Cuisine in London -- on the Wave Awards in London. We are very proud of that. It just shows that we have a high-quality product, delivering in all the aspects of the product. And if you also look at all the other awards we have received this year, it speaks for themselves, that we have a high-quality product and a fantastic crew on board our vessels. Next, please.
Sales and marketing. The focus remains on growing the sales through our own channels. And we have established a very high level of sales through our own channels, average 55% to 57% this year. It looks the same next year. This is very high compared to this industry, which we are, of course, very satisfied with. And we will continue focusing on sales through our own channels.
We also have -- just a couple of weeks ago, we started with our new campaign, building our brand is extremely important. And the new campaign, Enter the Northern Calm, with the world's first noise forecast, has been received by the market and the customers very well. I think yesterday, we saw that the first 2 weeks, more than 8 million Americans have been into and looked at the videos. And in the U.K., more than 6 million have looked at the video. So the activity towards both in the web and the customer center is quite improving, looking at the big interest for the company.
We also have focused on building our new CRM system which will be fully implemented end of this year, which will support marketing, sales and customer service, and enable us to really follow the customer journey much better than we have been able to do so far. It's extremely important to -- for us to utilize. And of course, we have a high focus on sales initiatives to enable better occupancy and bookings through the low season and parts of the route with lower occupancy, which we have been able to improve a lot this second half of 2024. Next, please.
And this year, end of November, we had confirmed bookings of 73% of the total capacity. We expect it to grow end of December to about 75%. We also have -- are very good looking into next year for bookings of 41% of the total capacity. And new contracts with kind of the travel agencies and agents enable us to have confirmation of firm bookings earlier than in time than we had last year and this year. So we are quite confident of the bookings going forward.
We have kind of much higher bookings from Bergen to Kirkenes, and the northbound voyage than on the southbound voyage, it's about 8% to 10% difference. And with the initiatives we have implemented and the focus we have had on the bookings, we do see that into 2025, the balance is back. So now it's more even on the north and southbound route, and that is very positive for next year.
Next, please. Aleksander?
Okay. Thank you, Bent. Moving from volume to pricing. If you look at the cabin rate for the third quarter of this year, we've achieved a year-on-year growth of 30% versus the same period last year. If you look at the outlook going forward, there's kind of 2 reasons why we see a very positive pricing or ACR outlook next year.
And it's got 2 things. It's one, we have a runoff of rebooked trips from previous cancellations, which is positively impacting pricing. There were a lot of cancellations in 2022 and 2023 because of the late delivery of the ships, and these have impacted pricing throughout this year. But we expect that, that will run off next year and we'll see a positive price effect from that.
And combined with a list price increase of about 20% for 2025, I think the ACR outlook, it is very good. And we're looking at the range of approximately 20% to 30% increase for the year in total. And kind of the level 20% to 30% is going to depend a bit on volume. Right now, we're steering towards the upper part of that range, but we'll balance that throughout the year with the occupancy rates.
And we think that this pricing, it kind of reflects the superior product that we are offering on the Coastal Route. It reflects award-winning ships. It reflects award-winning cuisine. So it really reflects the product that we are offering to our travelers. And if you look a little bit further out, 2026, there's additional room for growth in the ACR kind of over and above the inflation or underlying cost increases, and we see that being both related to product development.
We are -- compared to the historical ways of operating this route, we are offering shorter trips, 3 days and 6 days, where we are looking to combine pre- and post-voyage activities that will have additional revenue streams. So I think we -- and there is a higher willingness to pay for a shorter trip than an 11-day trip. So I think this is an additional price effect that could come into play in 2026 onwards. Next slide, please.
So what we've done this quarter is we've split out the onboard spend. In the previous KPIs reported, we had an ACR which included presold onboard activities. We've split that out, so the KPIs historically also changed slightly. On the onboard spend, we had 11% year-on-year growth compared to the same period last year. And on the onboard sales is really a focus area for next year, and we're -- we have a number of initiatives which are under implementation or to be implemented early next year. And these are kind of activity generating -- revenue-generating activities.
I think, first of all, we see that the pricing onboard, there's room for a price increase compared to what the market for similar products have. There's an opportunity to unbundle certain amenities or services that have previously been included, which has been included in the start-up phase, but we see that there is a room to charge for that separately.
We are expanding on the onboard activities to improve the guest experience onboard. We are developing food and beverage courses. We're doing photo courses. We're having events on deck. We're having events in the bar. So I mean there's a number of initiatives to increase the activities onboard.
We're going through it on the excursion program, both from a margin perspective but also from kind of an experience perspective, we have excursions to focus on. And there's -- I think within the sales organization, there's a focus on upselling and training of sales staff and making kind of each ship an own hotel, which has their own responsibility to develop the results. Okay. Next slide, please.
Looking at the operating costs. We've split out the operating cost this quarter on the different cost. And if you look at the cost for the third quarter, it's about 8% up compared to the first and second quarter this year. It's mainly due to increased activity, increased cost of goods in the third quarter, but also an increase in payroll, both admin and payroll crew, which is related to the annual wage adjustment which had a retroactive effect from May, which were booked in the third quarter.
We see that, for next year, we will manage the overall cost level. And part of that is, especially on the cruise side, it's kind of optimizing the operation. It's having a more even occupancy on the northbound route and the southbound route, which is positive for the manning of the ships. So we think that we are going to manage the kind of cost levels next year. And we also have, on the last 2 ships, which have been manned up, we have trained seasonal personnel. So there's going to be less of that going into 2025. Next slide, please.
So summing it up. The operating revenues are growing rapidly, and we're combining that with a very modest growth in the cost levels, which is a balancing act in itself to grow the top line while maintaining cost at a reasonable level. And the focus going forward is to continue that for 2025, and kind of grow the yield or the margin on the existing capacity that we have. So it's -- we're targeting a very modest volume growth, but quite steep price increase or revenue increase per cabin compared to this year.
We are running a very lean onshore organization. And we're kind of doing everything we can to keep it digital, to keep it automated, and we're going to continue to do that. So any kind of growth initiative that we are seeking, be it pre or post activities, is focused on digital solutions that limits the number of people that we need to hire on. Next slide, please.
Yes. So going over to the debt overview and kind of our refinancing update, we have provided a table this time around on the debt. The very high cost of capital or high debt cost that we have is kind of reflective of past issues and not reflective of the underlying business. So the secured debt that we have, it's a bridge financing for 3 years, starting in July 2023 and it runs until 2026. And it's really a bridge financing to take us through kind of a start-up period.
And we see that with the growth we have in the operational results and the underlying asset values that we have, we're in a good position to achieve a refinancing of that debt in 2025. And as a company, we have a goal to fix that 12 months prior to maturity to avoid it being current.
We have positive discussions on refinancing. The banks are positive. We have discussions with the institutional lenders, et cetera. And they like the assets, they like the contract with the government, which is what creates kind of a stable revenue and more of an infrastructure like play. And they really like the environmental profile of the company and the ships. And it's this type of -- a lot of companies are talking about making an impact on the environmental side, but we are really doing it. And I think most banks and lenders we have met have been very impressed about what we have achieved so far on the environmental side.
If you look at the shareholder debt, is very flexible. It's noncash-yielding debt. It can be repaid at any time without any premium. So it's there to help the company through the start-up phase. And if you look at the overall kind of cash interest that we are looking at for the next 12 months, it's approximately NOK 325 million based on the forward curve for Euribor, and we see that being manageable with the outlook we have for EBITDA for next year. We'll go into that during the last few slides. Next slide, please.
So we have substantial positive value-adjusted equity. And we think it's quite important to get this message across. Because our book equity is negative NOK 182 million, and part of that is reflected of unrealized currency losses, which is owing to the fact that the ships are booked in the balance sheet based on construction or acquisition costs in NOK, while the debt is reported in euro. And there's been a substantial depreciation of the kroner against the euro since the ships were delivered. So that is part of the reason why the equity is -- the book equity is negative.
The second thing is the assets are priced in currency in the, secondhand market and also in the newbuilding market. So if we go out and order new ships, similar ships today, these will be priced in euro or USD. And we collect broker values every quarter for the ships. And at the end of the third quarter, the average broker value for the ships were NOK 700 million, which is almost 2x that of the book value.
So if you look at in value-adjusted equity, it's close to NOK 3.9 billion. So combined with positive outlook on the operational side and the manageable cash flow, we don't see a need to raise additional capital. We are focusing on optimizing the business and getting the position where we can refinance the secured debt. Next slide, please.
Looking at the share, it's -- we have a very low free float of shares and the liquidity is quite low. So the share is very vulnerable to investors buying or selling more than a handful of shares. So that is kind of what has happened during the year. We had a few larger shareholders buying in the period and then there's been a few medium-sized shareholders selling, which has driven and impacted the share price.
If you look at the equity story long term, I think the kind of first trigger is delivering on the operational results, achieving that EBITDA level that we are guiding on. It's then based on that facilitating a refinancing. And through that, kind of realizing the underlying values we have, both in the ships but also in the kind of setup that we have being an established operator on the Coastal Route. So we're well positioned for the next concession round with lower CapEx on the ships and a lean organization. So we're quite optimistic about our position going into the next concession around, which is starting from 2030 onwards. Next slide, please.
So I think overall, we remain committed to delivering value to the stakeholders, be it shareholders, lenders, the government, coastal communities, the environment, et cetera. And we are committed to delivering experiences -- unforgettable experiences to our guests. And if you look at it year by year, I was talking about this bridge financing and the kind of a ramp-up of the business.
If you look at 2024, it's really in the first year. We call it internally year 0, and it's the first year of full operations with all 4 vessels. We're looking at an occupancy level of just about 75% for the year in total. We have an ACR, average cabin rate growth, close to 30%, which is good. And we're targeting an annual EBITDA for the full year of about NOK 200 million. And this is giving us an EBITDA margin close to 12%, which is what we call year 0.
And for next year, we've spent a lot of time this fall on the budget. And what we are focusing on next year is price and margin improvement. We are targeting a refinancing based on delivering on the operational side in 2025, based on ACR growth of about 20% to 30%. And maintaining costs similar to inflation and adjusted for the activity level, we are looking at an EBITDA of NOK 400 million to NOK 500 million as a target. And we're, based on that, looking at an EBITDA margin of about 25%.
Going further out in 2026, we see there's a lot of potential for developing the product, be it onboard sales or be it development of different legs of the route. And then there's big potential also for developing additional revenue streams, and be that pre and post activities, we're looking at offering flights, offering hotel in kind of a limited way, but something that enables us to sell kind of smaller packages, 3-day trips, where the travelers can or the guests can really have an active vacation or they have experiences on land combined with the experience on our ships along the route.
And so based on that, we are looking at an ACR growth of about 10% to 15% versus 2025. And that's not including these additional revenue streams, that is really including kind of the underlying price growth and some more potential that we see in the pricing. And we're looking at an occupancy target of closer to 80% for 2026. And that is giving us an overall EBITDA of around NOK 600 million to NOK 800 million. And we're then moving into an EBITDA margin range of around 30% to 40%. Okay. Next slide, please.
Yes. I think we've been through most of these KPIs during the presentation. What I find interesting in this is, over and above what we have talked about, is the cabin factor which is how many people do we have on board in our cabins. And what we see is that we have gone from 1.7, 1.75 and then now we're up at almost 1.9. And this is really positive. We have capacity on board to increase the level further. And the more people we have onboard, the more onboard spending we have. So I think this is -- this slide, this is kind of one of the positive factors that is worthwhile mentioning.
So I think that kind of concludes -- you can jump to the next slide, but I think that kind of concludes the presentation. So we'll open up for a Q&A session now, Sarah.
[Operator Instructions] And we received already our first virtual hand from Tim Kruse.
Yes, very encouraging, especially the EBITDA outlook. Much appreciated also the additional information you gave in this presentation on a lot of points. I think it's very positive. I have a few questions actually, and maybe I'll take them one by one and maybe join the queue for some follow-ups. But first would be on your EBITDA outlook for 2025 and the budget. What's sort of your expectation on LNG costs? We as saw a bit of rise in energy prices in the last few weeks or months, so what's factored in for LNG prices for next year in your budgeting?
Yes. We have -- for the budgeting, we have factored in approximately around EUR 40 per megawatt hour, on TTF price of EUR 40 per megawatt hour. But we are looking at some initiatives to -- and that's based on the spot price. We have some flexibility on the indexation of part of the purchases. But that's kind of where we are. We think -- if you look at the contract with the government, we are compensated for increases in LNG price. It's just not happening in the year that we have the cost increase, it's coming in the year after.
So if you look at the long term, we have a hedge on the LNG in the contract with the government. But in the short term, we're managing the fluctuations. We've done some hedging earlier this year. At the moment, we are open. And around EUR 40 per megawatt hour is kind of what we've had in the budget so far.
And that sort of reflects current levels more or less? Or...
Yes. Today, it fluctuates. But today, it's a little bit higher. It's -- the spot price today, it's a little bit higher. But we don't see that kind of -- we see that going out in time. The LNG market is well supplied, and the prices are higher during the winter season and usually lower during the summer season. So I think the level of [ EUR 40 ] is quite comfortable with that at the moment.
Okay. Perfect. Then on sort of price increase and occupancy outlook for next year, you mentioned you had 41% sold for the next year. Can you maybe comment on how that compares to last year's number? And then secondly, on the cabin price increases, which is I think, yes, overall positive sign for your product, as you say, and well deserved there. But is that only price increase? Or are you also working on cabin layouts and sort of different price categories of the cabins?
I mean that's mainly price, it's not related to layout. It's kind of a function of -- in Norwegian, they call it [ old funds ], but it's kind of a function of all these cancellations and rebookings that we have previously, which has impacted pricing negatively. And then it's combined with hiking of prices. I think the pricing initially was a bit lower to fill the ships. But I think we're at the moment now where kind of the -- if you look at the occupancy this time of the year compared to last year, it's slightly -- it's not very different, but it's...
A bit higher.
A bit higher.
A bit higher, but the revenue is much higher.
Yes. So the revenue on the volume that is on the books is a lot higher than last year. And for us, on the pricing side, we are, of course, having a higher price on the travelers that are booking directly with us, and those are booking in a shorter window.
Okay. And then final question on -- or question bundle on the refinancing. Can you maybe, Aleksander, say sort of from your perspective, what would be your ideal structure of a new financing? Sort of is it only bank loans or bonds or a mixture, sort of from your view today? And in addition to that, are you aiming to also repay part of the shareholder loans with the refinancing, so not only the B tranche, but also part of the shareholder loans?
I think we are kind of exploring all options at the moment, be it bank financing, institutional financing, leasing to find the right mix or the right structure for us. But the focus for next year is the secured debt, the bond loan. That is the core focus, to refinance that 12 months prior to maturity. And in a structure that makes sense for the banks and some of the -- I think the ideal situation is to refinance that first and then we will look at how to structure the shareholder debt and whether we do on the secured bond. That could be one part of the solution, but I think we haven't come to that level yet.
Okay. And then final question on the broker value. I mean I'm -- my question there is always how tangible is that value? Is it -- and then how do they arrive at these valuations? Is it like sort of a cost-based approach? Or is it actual kind of what they would go into marketing these ships? And who would be potential buyers, because it is a layout of a ship which is quite specific for your needs and for the route you are taking? So that would be helpful if you could comment on that, Bent, maybe.
Yes. Bent, you want to...
Just to make a correction there, Tim, is that, yes, the vessel is designed with the capacity to operate to London-Norwegian coast in the specific Coastal Route, that's correct. But the vessels are also designed and built has expedition vessels. So there are no kind of major conversion costs to operate these vessels in expedition segment. And of course, that's how the brokers also compare these vessels in the market. So the vessels are quite attractive in the expedition market also due to the environmental side of it. So the vessels are prepared for expeditions.
They usually base that on the brokers evaluate kind of what is the second market for the ships and then they look at newbuilding costs. So if you look at the newbuilding costs for similar type of ships today, I think that is in the range where you'd end up -- including supervision, predelivery financing, et cetera, you'll probably end up in that range.
So we'll move on with the questions in the chat box. So we start with the first one. Can you please elaborate on the following sentence: The company is well positioned for growth opportunities in the coastal route, what does that mean exactly?
What it means is that the Norwegian government is presently evaluating the next concession. And we believe that next year, they will reveal kind of the requirements and they will also come out with a tender. So this is -- what we have, we have new vessels which will be able to fulfill even more stricter environmental requirements. We can, today, sail climate-neutral, meaning reducing the CO2 by 90%. We are also prepared for zero emission.
So we do have the vessels already for the next concession fulfilling all requirements. So we think that we are well prepared for the next concession and also are able to grow the activity if there is, yes, a potential for us, of course. Everything needs to be considered, but our target is to grow around the Norwegian coast, of course.
And let just me add on that, Bent, we have the ships that can comply with any stricter regulations. And any stricter regulations within -- in that someone competing on this tender would have to construct new ships, which would be at the cost that we have indicated on the broker values. So again, we have been looking at the book value and the acquisition cost of the sips. We have kind of a low cost base or a low CapEx on the existing fleet, which can comply with new regulations. So where we will competing against the newbuilds. So I think that that's part of the reason why we see that we have a good position on the existing ships, in addition to the environmental profile.
All right. Further question. Just to clarify, is the broker value, the used price you would likely receive if you were to sell the vessels? Or is this the replacement cost you would have to pay today to construct the same vessel?
I think it's a combination of it. I mean, today, these ships are committed to the route. So they are committed to the contract throughout the contract period. So the realization of that value for us lies in the contract and the extension of the contract.
All right. And then we have a follow-up on that. So your goal is to go from 4 to 7 or 8 vessels during the next concession round starting 2031.
We have ambitions to grow, that's correct.
Okay. Then next question. Congratulations on the positive operating result. Feel free to elaborate on the elephant in the room. Negative equity and the terrifying debt interest costs eat up all profits, what is the solution, share issue and dilution?
I think we've partly covered that during the presentation and during the previous questions. But to repeat, we see substantial positive value-adjusted equity through the value of the fleet and also the setup that we have built on the route. So over time, we believe that without any equity injection, there is a substantial positive equity in the company, value-adjusted equity.
Looking at the debt, we acknowledge that it's a high-yielding debt and it's reflective of past issues. With the delivery of kind of the EBITDA that we are targeting next year, NOK 400 million to NOK 500 million, we will manage interest cost and we will be in a position to refinance that debt, which is we think is going to be one of the main triggers to increase activity in the shares and unlock some of the value in the shares, which is currently depressed by this high-yielding debt that is maturing in 2026.
All right. Are you planning to attend any investor conferences?
Yes. We are going to do that. So we are -- we would like to be more active in the market. We've started with having these earnings calls. We'll seek to participate in investor conferences around, which are relevant. And we're also looking at ways to kind of update the market more frequently on the trading performance, not necessarily on the financial side, but on the trading performance. We're looking at ways to update the market more frequently.
All right. So now we have a question that's a bit longer. As unrealized currency loss is higher than operating profit this quarter, can you tell us if the interest payments of the ship financing in euro is actually hedged? And what percentage of the unrealized currency loss is coming from the ship financing? Can we expect that the unrealized foreign exchange loss will be mainly obsolete when the refinancing is done next year?
That was a difficult question to take on the spot. But the debt, I mean, as long as we have balance sheet in NOK, we have assets recorded in NOK and debt in euro, we're going to have these large currency swings, which is unrealized currency gains and losses. So it's not going to -- refinancing is not going to cure kind of the currency effect. That is if the kroner appreciates against the euro, then we're going to see unrealized gains going the other way.
But back to the question of how much is related to currency, we can get back to that in our next reporting. How much of the -- since the debt was recorded and since the ships were delivered, I mean, how much negative unrealized gains or losses do we have on the currency, we can get back on that.
All right. Are there any opportunities for value creation through shareholder communications? Are you planning any improvement on how you engage with shareholders?
Yes. I mean, I think I partly covered that in the previous question. So it's -- we are -- in this time around, we're being a lot more open on KPIs where we have started guiding, because we're a lot more comfortable on the underlying figures and kind of the outlook on price and volume for the next few years. So I think -- and that necessitates kind of providing more frequent updates to track kind on the performance versus the guiding. So that's -- I think I have partly answered that question in the previous one as well.
Great. So then now we have 3 questions from the chat box left. Would you consider increasing your fleet if the opportunity arises?
Yes.
I guess it was a yes.
I'm sorry, it's a yes. [indiscernible] a question.
Are you considering a reverse split of your shares?
Yes.
Okay. And then the last question, are you planning to change reporting currency to euro next year?
I'm not going to say next year, but we are looking at it, whether to change the reporting currency. It's on the list of things that we are evaluating. So -- because we see that the profit and loss statement is difficult to read when you have these large swings between the asset side and the debt side.
And I think I forgot to mention in the previous question, but the majority of our revenues are in currency and are in euro, it's in dollar and it's in pound, which is why we have not hedged the currency so far. So we are utilizing that currency to pay off interest on the debt. And then the revenue from the government is in NOK, which is used to pay off costs in NOK, crew costs, local costs, operating costs, et cetera.
All right. Can you share some insight in the customer demand? Where do you see the growth coming from?
We have seen quite a positive increase in the U.S., Australia and New Zealand, and also growth in Switzerland and Austria. Still strong in Germany, but it's lower than it was initially. So the growth is basically the U.S., but also the U.K. And then we do see a very positive increase from Asia. So it's -- the picture is a bit -- changing a bit. And we do see that the average age of the customers are lower than what kind of historically have been into this route.
So the focus we have on kind of shorter trips, more activities, more flexibility for the customer have a positive effect on the age of those traveling with us. So we do see that the average age is closer to 50 years than previously 70. So it's -- the picture is, at least for us, changing. People traveling with us are very focused on the sustainability, the silence onboard the vessels and, of course, new vessels.
All right. Have you listed on the right stock exchange? For example, it is not possible to buy your stock on interactive brokers and other electronic platforms, that limits your liquidity.
I think at the moment, we will -- we remain listed on the Euronext Growth. But in a refinancing, it's not -- we're not going to rule out a listing on the main exchange. But at the moment, we're on the Euronext Growth. And then I think as we deliver on guiding and the targets for next year, it's natural to think that we're ready for the next step in terms of listing. But the listing for us is -- listing in Norway is the right thing, and this is where our routes are and where kind of the owners are and the contract with the government. So it would be -- us listing on the main exchange, that will be kind of the next step for us.
All right. And now we have 2 questions left. For the future, would you consider expanding in other routes?
You want to go through that?
I think our main focus is the Coastal Route now, and then we just have to see going forward whether we should expand also outside the Coastal Route.
Yes, there is a lot of potential on expanding the product along the Coastal Route, as I mentioned in some of the slides, these additional revenue streams from pre and post activities. And by -- historically, the route has been focused on the 11-day round trip, which gives you Bergen -- or Bergen and Kirkenes.
But providing -- offering these shorter trips, there's a very long list of opportunities where you can develop very exciting destinations and activities packaged with train, with flight, with hotel, et cetera. So on the Coastal Route, that is also an avenue which we are actively looking at from 2026 onwards.
All right. So now we covered all your questions. So thank you, everyone, for joining and to showing interest in Havila. So from my side, I wish you all a lovely remaining day. And hand back for some final remarks, which concludes our call.
Yes, I don't have much to say now. Thanks a lot for listening in, and we are happy to answer questions. If anyone has more questions, please do not hesitate to take contact with us. Thank you.
Thank you.