Bravida Holding AB
STO:BRAV
Bravida Holding AB
STO:BRAV
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Hi, everyone, and welcome to the first quarter presentation of 2021. My name is Mattias Johansson, and together with me today is CFO, Åsa Neving. And today's agenda is that we're first going to take you through our market position in the Nordic, Q1 2021, the highlights and then the performance by country. And then we will end the session with a Q&A. So please think about some nice and good questions, and we'll try to answer them as good as possible.So we start with our position in the Nordic market. Many of you already know this, 12,000 employees in Sweden, Norway, Denmark and Finland. We are one of the few who can act like a one-stop shop to provide sustainable services for all our customers all over the Nordics. We have electrical services, heating and plumbing, HVAC, but we also have sprinkler, security, fire alarms, technical facility management, solar panels and some other smart things that you can use to improve your buildings.We have an LTM sales at around SEK 21 billion. 94% of all our customers are recurring customers, and 89% is contracts below SEK 50 million. And actually, the combination of many customers in many different places, different geographies and small average contract size takes down our risk in the business to a level that is quite nice. So the business model means that we create a lot of cash, we have a stable margin and we can continue to grow our business in a quite fragmented market, both by organic growth when the market support that, but also through -- to be a consolidator in the market regarding acquisitions.65,000 different customers also means that we have many different customers who are having different needs. And very -- we are not very much dependent on the market, quite low cyclicality because of many geographies and many different customers.So it's getting increasingly important to limit the global warming. And building stands for a significant part of all greenhouse gas emissions in the world today. And therefore, we play a key role to actually be part of this transition to make the society more sustainable.40% of all energy consumed in the society is actually used to warm or cool down buildings. So if we should do something about the climate, the greenhouse gas emission, we first need to use less energy, that is something we can help the customers with; and two, make sure that existing buildings needs or use less energy.So a new time means also that we need a new vision. And we have a new vision in Bravida. Bravida helps customers develop the full potential of the buildings through service and installation, we bring buildings to life, leading the way to sustainable and resilient society.I will argue that we are the Nordic leader in sustainable technical solutions. More customers ask for more energy-efficient buildings and smarter technologies. And we have a key role to play and support these needs to the customers. We can help them to use less energy, but we can also help them to do it in a smarter way.We need a new approach in the society, and we can act like a one-stop shop for the customers, provide an end-to-end solutions, to tell the customers what they need, how they should build the buildings to make sure that they use as less energy as possible. We are one of the few who can actually provide all different services to the customers. We have car chargers, for example, solar panels and we have services for the customers that can help them to use, do the analysis of the buildings so they can use less energy.And I think it's important to look at the life cycle perspective of all buildings. Sometimes you talk about the market and new-built buildings. But you can't forget about the rest of the existing buildings. 90% plus or something of our market is existing buildings, and we can help the customers to use less energy.So for a -- for many years, we have been installing the hardware for car chargers, for example. But now since a year back, we have entered into the solar panel business. It's a quite tricky industry so far, but we can see a very interesting combination of the 2.So just the last couple of weeks, we have launched what we call Bravida Charge, a complete solution for charging infrastructure. And not today yet, but in the very near future, we can combine the solar panel with car chargers and help the customers with the administration around this service.So today, we have what we call Bravida Charge, a tool that helps the customers to administrate what vehicle you are charging, who is charging, who was supposed to pay for the energy that you have charged there, for example, car fleet, with. As one example, we have one office in Sweden, where we, during the day, is charging the white collars' cars. And when needed, we also charge the service cars that are hybrid cars or electrical vehicles. But during the night, we can sell energy to the customers to a fitness center that is actually just beside our office. So this is an easy way that we can support our customers to help them in their transition so they can help the rest of the society to charge more vehicles in a better way. You can use that in our office, private industries, et cetera, et cetera. So this is a full-service solution for our customers that we have launched very recently.So the Q1 in 2021. And we're starting with a market outlook. We can see in the end of the quarter that the service is -- the service demand is definitely picking up, and that is, of course, good. We can see it still even if we have had an increased lockdown in Norway, we have had an increased lockdown in Finland and very stable circumstances in Sweden and Denmark.Temporarily, we have slightly softer installation business because of delayed project starts and decisions from the customers. But we still -- I still hear from the organization that we still have a good demand. We see that the RFQs is picking up. We win some contracts, et cetera. So it's quite positive for the future.A big difference, if we compare to a year back, is that the demand is more focused on sustainable solutions. We can play a key role to support our customers to be more sustainable to help them to reach their own sustainable[Audio Gap]quarter. Net sales is down by 3%. And I think that is quite a strength. Even if we have lost sales at 19% in our second largest market, which is Norway, and still, we are close to flat regarding sales. Even stronger, I think, it is with the margin, 5.1% in the quarter, and then we have some adjustment related to, for example, the business plan. So we actually are improving the margin.Cash conversion, 121%. Service is flat. We had a quite weak first quarter of March last year because then that was when the pandemic started. The installation sales growth is down 6%. We still have a really strong order backlog. But in this quarter, it was quite soft. Order backlog is growing with SEK 600 million in the quarter, which is, of course, positive. We had a strong order backlog already in the beginning of the year, and it had strengthened even more.So net sales, if we try to do the bridge, organic growth, minus 4%; acquisitions, plus 3%; and then we have FX currency, minus 2%. So losing 90% in our second biggest market, still improve the margin quite decent sales. We see that it will -- this will pick up the coming months. That's my estimate at least.EBITA, 5.1% in margin compared to 5% last year. Lower EBITA in Norway due to lower sales in the Norwegian business due to the lockdown, I would say -- sorry, the sales is down, the margin is unchanged, improved EBITA in Finland and Denmark and slightly lower in Sweden. EBITA is affected by some extra costs regarding -- related to the business spend and digitalization, but also some extra costs depending on the LTIP program, depending on the strong share price development in the first quarter.Order intake and backlog. The order intake is up 1% in the quarter, which is, of course, positive. But again, the order backlog, which is more important for us, strengthened with SEK 600 million -- or by SEK 600 million in the quarter. It was strong before and it's even stronger now. And we can see service growth in Sweden, Denmark and Finland.So last but not least, health and safety. We see an improved LTIR in all countries, except for Sweden, where it goes up a little bit. We have a high focus on this, and we try to improve this every day, every week, every month. And we saw last year that we improved it significantly, especially in Finland and Denmark. And hopefully, we can continue that important work during 2021 as well.So by that, we end this part of the presentation with acquisitions. We have done or actually closed 4 deals in the quarter, adding around SEK 300 million in sales. And then after the quarter, we have signed a couple of more acquisitions, adding SEK 130 million approximately, and we have done acquisitions in all countries except for Norway this year, and we see still a strong pipeline. So we think that we continue -- can continue to do acquisitions, and we can consolidate the market. So the pipeline is strong, and I'm really looking forward to see what we can do to consolidate the market even more. So by that, over to you, Åsa.
Thank you. So we start with Sweden. In Sweden, we had a growth of 1% in the quarter. We had a high production in -- this growth comes from both installation and service. We have had a high production in the Northern part of Sweden and a bit slower in the Southern part of Sweden. We have our largest division in the South. And there, we've had a decrease in service for some time for the last quarters. But now this quarter, it is picking up again, which we are happy to see.The EBITA level in Sweden was 5.5% or the margin compared to 5.6% last year. And we also had -- as Mattias mentioned, we had some costs for realizing some IT projects in the business plan of roughly SEK 5 million. So with that in mind, we were on a flat margin with last year. If you look at the order intake, it was plus 9% and what we were also happy to see that -- is we -- that this quarter also had an order intake -- a positive order intake in our largest division, South. The backlog year-on-year, minus 4%, but growing in the quarter. So we have a strong backlog in Sweden, and it has been growing during this quarter.Moving to Norway. Norway has, as Mattias said, been the most affected by the pandemic. So here, we have had a negative growth of minus 19%. In local currency, it was minus 16%. The organic growth was also negative then with minus 16%. We have seen a decrease in service from the beginning of the pandemic last year. And it has continued to decrease. Now it is still decreasing, but not at the same speed in this quarter. Installation has also been slow, and we've had a decrease -- a negative growth in installation projects. This is due to the fact that we see delayed project starts and delayed planning in projects. Despite this lower volume, we had a margin on the same level, 4.5%, which is pretty good with those circumstances. The order intake was strong in Swedish kroner, but more or less flat in local currency. The order backlog is plus 6% year-on-year and almost at the same level in local currency, but it is increasing in the quarter, let's see, SEK 172 million.Denmark then. Denmark has been one of our growth engines for some time. It is still growing in local currency this quarter by 5%. It's flat in Swedish kroner. We have -- Denmark has also been -- has had lockdowns, and we have seen a decrease in service for some time here. But service is now also picking up in Denmark. So we're happy to see that. The organic growth was flat. The EBITA margin was 5.2% compared to 4.7% last year. And last year, we had some costs for integration of acquired companies. I can explain that difference. The order intake was minus 17% in Swedish kroner, but in local currency, minus 6%. The backlog is decreasing, minus 5% year-on-year and it also -- is a small decrease in the quarter, but we had a strong order back from the beginning -- order backlog from the beginning in Denmark.Moving to Finland. Finland is continuing the positive trend. We have a growth of 18%; in local currency, plus 25%. And this growth is due to both installation and services. The service growth here is from acquisitions. The organic growth is also high on 18%. EBITA is continuing to improve, 2.6% margin this year compared to 0.4% last year. The order intake is down 52%. This sounds a lot. But the reason for this is that we had a large order last year when we got in Wärtsilä project, and that explains almost the entire difference. The order backlog is then, for same reason, negative -- minus 20% and there is -- year-on-year and there's also some decrease in the -- during the quarter.Then we move back to group again and looking at the net debt and cash flow. We still have a strong cash flow. It is decreasing compared with last year, SEK 144 million compared to SEK 560 million. This is due to a negative change in working capital. And this happens when we have a slowdown in installation projects that we've had now. We -- when we have slower project start, we also see that we have less procurement of materials. We usually procure a lot in the beginning. And we also have fewer favorable payments plan -- payment plans and this leads to a negative change in working capital.Moreover, we have also paid taxes in Denmark. We have paid deferred taxes that were postponed due to the pandemic. They were paid out this year, DKK 55 million. But the large reason is the working capital. Cash conversion, still strong, 121% versus 127% last year. And the net debt-to-EBITDA ratio is very low on 0.6x compared to 1x last year.Then concluding with our financial targets. We have an EBITA margin target of more than 7%. We reached 6.4% last year. Now we are on 5.1% compared to 5.0% last year, so improving a little bit. We'll see where this will end this year. We have a sales growth target of more than 5%. So far, it's negative. Adjusted for currency, it's on minus 1% and nonadjusted, on minus 3%.Cash conversion, well above target on 121%. And the net debt-to-EBITDA is -- our target is to be below 2.5x and we are, as I said, well below that on 0.6. And also we have a target of a payout ratio, dividend payout ratio of more than 50%, and we reached that last year. And we are aiming to have a good result this year as well.I will stop there, Mattias. Hand back to you. Here we go.
Thank you very much. Just to summarize the presentation and the Q1 report for 2021. A positive shift in demand for service, mainly in Sweden and Denmark. You know we had a lockdown -- increased lockdown in Norway. Increased order backlog in the quarter, plus SEK 600 million. Norway, of course, negatively impacted by the COVID-19. All countries are negatively impacted, but I think Norway is even more in this quarter depending on the increased lockdown, as I mentioned a couple of times.But still an improved margin, 5.1%, even if we have had some difficulties in our second largest market. Implementation and costs for the business plan is affecting the EBITA to some extent. So when you look at all these facts, I think it's a strong result in a declining, say, with a declining sales in a quite difficult market, I would say, service market to still be able to improve the margin. And the service market is picking up in the end of the quarter. We still -- we see slightly increased demand for our installation projects as well. So let's see if the temporarily softer market depending on the late decision or no decisions, how it will impact us the coming months. But we have a strong order backlog. So quite positive for the future.And I think if you take a step back and look what we have done in the last couple of years, I think these 3 graphs actually shows the beauty of our business model, to be able to consolidate the market, the combination of organic and acquired growth, increase the sales every year and do it with a very stable or improved margin. And a really strong cash flow that you can use to continue to develop your business even more is, of course, a fantastic way to do business.So before we open up to Q&A, I'm sorry again for the difficulties, problems, et cetera. But I think this is showing me that you can never be enough prepared and that all installation in a building is a critical part of the infrastructure in a building. So I think before we leave this place, I think I will have an order with me to give to the rest of the organization so we can improve the installations maybe. So thank you very much. Then we can open up for questions.
[Operator Instructions] And we are now taking our first question.
It's Carl here from Nordea. I have a few questions. First of all, in terms of the service growth in Sweden and Denmark, could you please try to specify if you see a broad growth throughout your end market customer groups or if you see recovery in some specific segment on the service side? And also, if you have seen any changes in the service demand throughout the quarter, i.e., if you have seen a stronger demand, for instance, in the end of Q1?
Yes. Carl, yes, definitely, a stronger demand in the end of the quarter. And we are trying to look into if there are different segments, customers types, et cetera, who are actually increasing demand. But I think it's more about that -- my guess is that people are getting quite tired of not doing anything. So I think it's a bit of positivism and also the need of actually doing something that is driving this. No specific structured changes but overall, an increased demand. And of course, that is good to see.
Okay. Brilliant. And -- oh, I can't hear myself there. Okay. Norway, obviously quite challenging in Q1. But I wonder whether you have seen demand in Norway pick up again at the end of the quarter. Or should we expect demand to pick up when the restrictions ease? Or how should we look at that going forward?
I think you should -- we can't see the demand picking up on the service side in Norway but we can -- I think I have a sense of that the demand for installation is picking up a bit in Norway. I have no numbers on it. It's more when I see the win rate on new contracts. But -- so I think it's very much when they open up the society again, I think the demand will increase. That's -- Norway is a bit special in this perspective because it's -- yes, it is the trickiest market for the moment because it is -- has been closed down the most as well.
Okay. And also, you have previously talked about the general price pressure. Are you still experiencing that?
No. I think when we have the discussion in the organization, first, we have been quite cautious about trying to win project with low prices because we -- as I have said to you many times, we have -- we think we have a strong order backlog. And that has given us the opportunity to not be stressed, try to win projects with low margin or low prices. So we have been quite calm regarding that topic. So -- but we hear now that the price is picking up again. It seems like some players in the market has won enough, and we are in position, again, to win some contracts. So I think there is not a big difference, but it is definitely on the positive side regarding the price.
Okay. Perfect. The final one from my side, if I may. Maybe I missed it, but have you said anything about the expected time of closure of the Minel acquisition?
No, we haven't. But the work continues, and it's depending on the structure of doing the deal. So we are a bit late in the process, but to be able to discuss with the persons we need to discuss, we were -- we thought it was a good idea to communicate it because it's such a large deal. So we want to have the opportunity to work in the way we think is the best for the deal. But it -- some delays, but we are getting closer.
Are you still 99% certain that you will close it? Or have you...
I think it's a slightly different type of percentage, but it's close to 100%, yes.
And we will now take our next question.
Stefan Andersson, SEB. So just a question first on -- a follow-up on the -- on Norway there. You're talking about -- the demand, I guess, is one thing -- one way to do it. But to put it in a different perspective, last Q2 last year was also rather weak on top line. So if you compare the situation now to last year, would you say that activity is also softer? Or would it be higher?
I really don't remember. But I think it -- the society in Norway is -- hasn't been as close as it is today. So I think the possibility in the market should be worsen compared to last year. On the other hand, I think we can handle it in a better way. We have done some cost reductions. We are working in a smarter way, and I think the margin shows that we are handling it in a good way. But there is going to be a lot of investments in the Norwegian business in the future. That's something I'm pretty sure of. You have very strong balance sheet in the society as well. So compared to last Q2, I'm not sure but -- I think it's tougher now, but we can handle it in a better way. On the other hand, we are getting closer and closer to opening up the society again. So let's see what Erna is doing in the coming weeks.
Yes. And then on the Minel, also a follow-up, not on the question if you close it or not. But would you think that you will have a decision -- if it's a closing of the deal or deciding to walk away, is that decision still coming during Q2, as you said before? Or is there a delay into Q3 now?
Yes. No, I think it will be -- we have a decision on that in Q2. But I think, without going too deep into the discussion, it's a technicality, how we want -- how we and the seller wants to do the deal. And I think it's more that we need to support them in some certain actions. So I think that is what has caused the delay. So definitely in Q2.
Okay. Good. And then on -- just a small thing there, which I couldn't read in the report. I don't think you mentioned it either. But the financial net seem to be a little bit lower than I thought. Is there anything specific in there? Or is this the clean interest rate for the financial cost for the quarter.
I couldn't hear what you said. You said the financial...
Are the financial cost of -- sorry, there's an echo here. But the financial cost of SEK 9 million, is that the normalized level? Or it seems a little bit low to me, but is there a positive one-off in there? Or is that just a new level?
No. We don't have any -- no, there are no positive one-offs in there. No.
The debt level is lower. So I guess just wanted to make sure. And then one question. Going back, just curious, going back to 2017, '18, when residential was a little bit of an issue, you were very clear saying that you didn't have a lot of exposure to the resi market, especially on new build. We're in a different situation now with offices being questioned a little bit, hotels as well and retail space. So it's more a tilt to logistic and the industrial and as well as resi. Resi is very strong. So just curious if you're also exploring that market, if you are part of the resi market as well or if you still have a very, very small portion into that?
No. But I think the residential market is important for the whole market because it will give some of our -- some players in the market occupied with doing that. And I think still, the residential market, it's too transparent price model to be really interesting for us. And I am not agreeing on what you're saying on the office market. I think the office market will be changed. But there is a lot of renovation and rebuilding that is needed to be done because of another way of using the office area. So I think that market is very interesting for us. You saw the break we had in this presentation, the installation getting more and more critical in buildings and that is for sure. And so I don't think that the office market will -- I think the new build offices market will go down, but the renovation and rebuilding of offices will probably pick up, and that's good for us. I'm not looking into the resi market more but -- yes.
I was talking about the new build, but good answer on the resi. So you're not moving into that. Then the final question is, I guess, you already answered it a little bit. But I was maybe curious on the investments you need to do. I mean we're far into 2021 now, and I would have hoped to a more specific cost than SEK 25 million to SEK 40 million, which is a rather wide span. But I guess, given that you have that on the slide, you're not going to give us a more specific number than that spread, I guess.
That is what you get today. Let's come back to that when we know. We have a couple of initiatives that we are working with that is getting closer and closer to the final investment. So we come back on that when we think we have an answer to give you. But it is a positive type of investment that will strengthen us as a company, but also strengthen our ability to make our customers more sustainable as well. So I'm happy to come back with that, Stefan, but you have to have some patience.
Absolutely. Just to double check there. The SEK 14 million was the total cost. But how much of the SEK 25 million to SEK 40 million have you in the quarter?
I think it's...
It's SEK 6 million.
Yes.
And we will now take our next question.
This is Peter Testa from One Investments. And a couple of questions, please. The first one, just if you could help us with the timing on the installation side. And you mentioned the working capital, that because there've been sort of slower starts that the working capital was negatively impacted. But then you've also started to sequentially see[Audio Gap]sort of sense as to when you think that will start to flow through into the installation side of the revenue on a better trend, please?
Maybe I should try to start in the North so I can fill in. I think it's hard to estimate when we will come back again because we have some orders, contracts that we have in the books, but they are waiting to start the building. And then we are not able to charge for materials, which we are buying, with quite good payment terms, et cetera. So I think it's quite difficult to actually say something about the timing. But we have -- some of this depends on no decision or late, delay decision. But then in the Nordics, some of the projects is -- that is not that many projects starting during the winter. I think during the spring is more common that you start up new projects as well, depending on conditions in the ground, et cetera. So yes, Åsa, do you want to add something?
No. I think that is -- yes, that's the way it is. And we don't -- we expect some larger projects to come in, in the future and then, of course, there will be a positive effect on the working capital. We've had some large projects where we had good payments plan that we are now eating of, you can say. So we need some new ones to get the working capital moving in the right direction.
And you said cash conversion last year, around 150% or sometimes, it's extremely high. And of course, there is some paradising as well, I guess.
Yes. Okay. And then just one specific question on Finland. As the Wärtsilä contract works its way through, should we expect other business to come through that might replace that in time? Or would you expect some, say, a back to a more normal trend in Finland?
Regarding the large projects of contracts in Finland, is that the question?
Yes. Regarding the Wärtsilä project and the impact that's having as it earns its way to the [ business ].
No. First of all, we -- for many years since we entered into Finland, we haven't been good enough or been in position to actually win that type of project. And I think Wärtsilä project is, one, quality label, if you can say it like that, that we are a player, the #4 player, fifth player in the Finnish market that you can count on. So that is actually showing that we have the ability, the competencies, the resources to win large projects and contracts as well. And we are executing very well on that one. So we expect that type of contract to be part of our ordinary business in Finland. But then, of course, it's about the risk and price and then you should have some projects as well. And you can expect projects like that in the future, but we don't have any in the pipeline for the moment. And when we have it, we will, yes, communicate that.
Right. Okay. And last question, please. You mentioned in the outlook a comment about being affected by rising raw material prices. And I was wondering if you could give some sort of sense as to how your backlog margin is structured vis-à-vis raw materials and extent to which you feel that this is -- this might be a challenge initially during the year before recovering on new business.
First of all, an average contract in Bravida is around 9 to 12 months, from start to the day when you finalize the projects. And we have actually internally discussed the increased raw material prices since October, November last year. So when we are discussing the pricing, the tender, et cetera, that's a part of our way of discussing because every spring, April -- March, April, we get an increase in salary and we get normally an increase in material prices. This time, we have been discussing the raw material increases for 6 months, and then we have tried to take that into consideration when they're doing the pricing. And now we actually -- when we win -- winning contract, we try to lock the prices and the material purchasing as soon as possible. So we have some different techniques to actually make sure that we are not the one who has to pay for these increases. Then in Norway, it's very common with index clause, for example, which is -- yes, then it's handled in the contract.So I think we have a toolbox to handle this. And it is usually not a very big problem. And then, of course, we are working with imports, direct imports. The negotiation with partners, we are having to make sure that we can help them or make sure that we still have the right prices. So we have a high focus on it, but I'm not very concerned about it. Of course, that will -- it might have an impact temporarily on the margin, but that is increases that we can pass-through to the market in some way.
There are no further questions at the moment. [Operator Instructions] And we just received another question.
This is Karl-Johan Bonnevier from DNB. Just a quick follow-up, Mattias. In the final quarters of last year, you talked about price pressure in the market, making you reluctant to sign and build order backlog. Now when your back -- say, building order backlog again, is that a good sign that you're also seeing a more, say, stable market development out there looking at pricing?
Yes. I would say so because we have been -- internally, we have discussed a lot, please don't try to win projects too low margin because the worst thing you can do, especially in the start of this year, is to be sitting in 6 months from now with a low price in the projects. Now we are very close to this phase. And we see that -- it seems like some of the competitors at least have -- they are not as hungry as they were before Christmas. I think the pricing environment has improved a bit. I have no facts that I can show you or as an evidence, but that is definitely the gut feeling I get when I speak to the organization.
And we just received another question.
It's Peter Testa again. I had one other question just on employee count. I was wondering if you could give some sort of sense as to what you're doing, please, on hiring in the different geographies and maybe in Sweden, breaking it between North and South Sweden. Just to get some understanding of where you are on your hiring processes, what you're doing with people who -- also the hours worked, these sorts of things.
First of all, we use subcontractors to make sure that we can produce the peaks in the production. It's too expensive to have all employees hired. So we are using subcontractors to -- for some specialties -- specialists, but also to take the peaks.But then we have different demands in different geographies. So the last 6 months or 3 months, I can say that we have probably had layoffs in South part of Sweden and in the Stockholm area. At the same time, we have hired in other areas. So it is a combination, and we are micro managing that in the branches. So depending on the local demand, they are hiring or having layoffs or using subcontractors. For the moment, we -- I think we have had a decrease regarding the amount of employees because of the lack of demand in some areas. And I think that's the first time for many, many years.And on the other hand, that is why we can defend the margin because we have a quite low fixed cost. 8%, 9% is fixed cost. The rest is actually adjustable cost, and the labor is part of that. So I'm not sure if I answered your question, but that is how it works, at least.
Yes. No, that was helpful. So as you go into the spring period, are you looking at sustaining that pace and taking any extra perhaps, your subcontractors at this stage? Or are there any areas where you think the hiring will step up?
No. We are hiring new staff every day in some places. But my vision is that we should have a position in the market to be the industry-leading company regarding sustainability, for example, to be more attractive to younger people with the new type of skill set. I'm sometimes saying that not everyone is actually allowed to work in Bravida. We should only have the best ones. So I think we are in a position where we can improve us even more but also attract the best talents, and that is what we have to do and what we are trying to do. And during the springtime, I think we will hire new personnel. And I think good people attract you, good people. So...
There are no further questions at the moment. Please continue.
Okay. Thank you very much. And the next upcoming event is our report in July. And meanwhile, think about the critical installation in all the buildings. Sorry for the delays earlier, but again, you can never be prepared enough, and installations are important in buildings. Thank you very much for listening and looking, viewing. Bye.