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Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to Sopra Steria's audio conference to present the results for the first quarter 2021. I will now hand the floor to Vincent Paris, CEO, over to you.
Thank you very much. Good morning, everybody, and welcome to this audio conference to talk about the publication of our results, the turnover of the first quarter 2021. For this conference, I'd like to suggest that we proceed firstly, we'll have an overview of the general situation. Then I will talk about the figures in detail for our operational units. And then thirdly, with Étienne du Vignaux, our CFO, who is with me, we will answer any of your questions. So with regards to the overall situation, just a couple of words about the market. The market is more buoyant than we experienced in previous quarters. I'll come back to that. I'll come back to different sectors. But nonetheless, we have a low level of visibility. So we are being cautious, low visibility compared to what we could have in previous years. But the good news is that the market is more buoyant. In terms of our business activity, our business activity was brisk, an improvement when compared with previous quarters, the sectors that have really been pushing. So defense and security, very active here. Perhaps you saw in the press release, we had 4 good signatures. So for the French Ministry of Defense, we signed the Brasidas program, which is an overhaul of a single information system for operational upkeep. So this is a major contract. Then we have been chosen as a cybersecurity partner for the European agencies eu-LISA and Frontex, so important positioning here. And then in the U.K. Highways England, we were chosen to develop an information system to manage national road traffic. And then in France, once again, the French Home Office chose us to develop a centralized border control system. So public -- power public sector, very active. And then in other verticals, we've seen improvement in trends. Some have been difficult, but the situation is better. Now a little bit more context. Obviously, we've restarted recruitment with headcount growing. Our bench rate is nominal, and it is under the rates we had in the first quarter of 2020. So this is good news. We've restarted recruitment since the start of 2021 with over 2,000 people who have joined us at group level, 700 in France. And then use of subcontracting has been restarted. Obviously, we lowered this last year to adapt to the crisis. So it's good news. We are restarting subcontracting. Against this backdrop, obviously, we had a negative organic growth of minus 0.5%. Obviously, basis comparable was unfavorable with last year, where we're very active up until mid-March, but we can say that all quarters -- so 4 quarters now have been improving where we were at minus 8.4%, minus 5.9% and then minus 4.2% restated after the cyber attack for the previous quarters. So obviously, we'll look at an analysis of our different reporting units, but the outlook, we are expecting growth as of the second quarter 2021. Now if we go around our operating units in France, organic growth was minus 6.3%. So this is where the unfavorable effect has been the most marked. I've seen this last year. We've got 2 verticals in particular, which were down. So aerospace and transport, and they are worth about 26% of the turnover in France. Aeronautic sector was down 19% and 16% down in transport. But aside from these 2 areas, the situation has improved across the board and we've seen that trends are improving quarter-on-quarter. We were at minus 12.6% in quarter 2, minus 15.4% in quarter 3 and then minus 10.3% (sic) [ minus 10.6% ] in quarter 4. So obviously, we've seen these effects at group level in particular, the public sector. What I could say, obviously, recruitment has restarted and we are using subcontracting now in France. So we are confirming return to organic growth as of the second quarter in 2021 in France. With regards to the U.K., good organic growth, even despite the context, so 16.8%, driven very much as was the case in 2020 by the 2 joint ventures that we have with the British government, so NHS and SSCL. The SSCL contract that was with the Ministry of Defense, it's pushing. It will carry over in the second quarter. And then obviously, a lot of volume for human resources management for the Department of Work and Pensions and the Ministry of Justice, where there's been significant activity and volumes. Rest of the public sector, good news. We've seen organic growth of around 5%. And then with the private sector in keeping with last year, not as good, but it's better than what we did in 2020 minus 16% growth compared with minus 19% over 2020. And we have the confirmation that there'll be a clear improvement as of the second quarter. Our objective is obviously to focus on a niche positioning where we can withstand better, and that will be our objective for the rest of this year. For the rest of Europe, organic growth of plus 28% with all countries that make up this Continental Europe block pushing, on average 4.6% and Sopra Financial Technology, you'll remember the operation that we have with the 7 Sparda banks is contracting. This was how the plan was put together. So no surprises here. This was what was planned. But just obviously, to understand the comparison effect here. The turnover was EUR 44 million, whereas we are at EUR 54 million the same period last year. So that's the results that we expect for each quarter in 2021. Obviously, we're following the operational plan. So organic growth of plus 4.6%. Good performance driven by Belgium, Germany and Scandinavia, but all countries have resisted well, as was the case for 2020. Now if we look at software, Sopra Banking Software, organic growth of minus 8.8% drop in -- because of a drop in service revenues. Obviously, the comparison was not favorable here, but we should improve this figure over the second quarter. In terms of major action plans, we're carrying on developing product synergies and offer digitalization to have a common digital layer. Then we're integrating Fidor, assembling the Fidor components with everything that we have all the investments that we've launched within Sopra Banking Software, and we should finalize the Fidor integration in the second half of 2021 and then carry on investing, positioning ourselves on the market as a digital stakeholder with this common digital layer, which will support all of our core banking systems, as previously explained. And then just to finish our overview other solutions. Organic growth is plus 3.2%. Start of the year was slow, but it's speeding up. At the same time, we're carrying on investments in order to accentuate product digitalization, open them up. And then obviously, guarantee their longevity and then to provide an input for growth. So those are different reporting units. Now just a few comments on our guidance for 2021. As said, the general environment is improving when compared with the last 3 quarters of 2020. At the same time, we are cautious. We have reduced visibility, the situation in some verticals is difficult. Even if there are improvements, we have to be cautious. Now just a reminder of our objective as we've set them on the 26th of February, organic growth in turnover between plus 3% and 5%, operational margin on business activity between 7.5% and 8%, and then free cash flow of EUR 150 million. So those are the general comments that we can make about the first quarter. Now I'd like to suggest that with Étienne, we answer your questions.
[Operator Instructions] We have a first question from Emmanuel Parot from Gilbert Dupont.
If you can hear me, I have 2 questions. I haven't really understood in the press release, things seem stable between December and then March, you've spoken about recruitment. Can you just perhaps come back to this point? So if we have comparable scope, what have we got in Q1? What is the outlook for the coming quarters? And then if you could talk about some contracting and then lack of which was divided by 2 last year. And then with Sopra Banking, are any licenses, which have been signed over the quarter or things that were pushed back from the previous year?
Yes. So with regards to recruitment, I confirm the figure of 2,000 recruitments at group level. Obviously, we've had some exits, less than normal, but we did have some exits. The market has restarted. So obviously, we're not at the same level as 2018, '19, but the level will be higher than 2020. And then obviously, seasonality effects, we have recruitment with interns and then conversions to permanent contracts that happens halfway through the year or in the second half of the year. So growth in headcount will play out in the 2 next quarters, essentially. So we are confirming standard trends, and we are more active in terms of recruitment than what we were at the start of the year. But once again, obviously, paying special attention and making sure that we are reactive in terms of any changes on the market. We haven't observed any for the moment, but I'd like to highlight this nonetheless. Subcontracting, we've gone from a EUR 700 million, so EUR 400 million in France, where we dropped by EUR 1,000 million. So we're talking about situation, which is clearly improved. With regards to the forecast that we have today, this should continue to improve. So that there's positive effect here. Obviously, we've seen the effects of -- the positive effects of subcontracting. It means that we can absorb different workloads more easily adapt to the situation when compared with last year. Obviously, it's a good way of ensuring growth for 2021. Obviously, we're working in all different areas, offshore. We're recruiting onshore as much as possible. And then we're pushing subcontracting as well. With regards to Sopra Banking Software, the volume of licenses was around EUR 6 million compared with EUR 8 million last year. Those are the figures -- those are roughly the figures.
Just a few more details now perhaps on the activity in the U.K., obviously, we've had the boost coming from the contract that you mentioned last year. So the organic growth, how much is it for the quarter?
So contribution obviously, I just want to make sure I don't make mistake -- any mistakes. So about EUR 20 million of growth was driven by the contract signed with the Ministry of Defense. So about EUR 60 million over the year if we look at the impact.
We don't have any other questions for the moment. [Operator Instructions] We now have a question from Derric Marcon from Societe Generale.
I hope you can hear me well. So 2 questions on Sopra Banking Software. Can we look at the level of the pipeline as it stands today when compared with where it was at the start of year? How are the deals coming in? And what's business activity looking like, discussions with customers? And then, obviously, more investment, what's going on in terms of licenses and subscription? And then for services, could you just give us a bit more granularity so we can understand what's going on here when compared with other business units? Why have we not seen more activity with regards to products that are already installed at customers? And then in terms of service activity, with products that are already rolled out, why has there not been more service activity?
So with regards to the overall situation context, slight improvement obviously, low visibility. So with regards to what I announced on the situation 2 months ago, I'd say roughly the same situation, no deteriorations. But it hasn't clearly improved. We still have the same context, it's active. There are a lot of questions coming from banks, but obviously, decisions may slip as well. And we still have uncertainty with regard to the different deals when decisions will be taken. So there's no fundamental changes here. In any case, the context hasn't deteriorated, but we do remain cautious. With regards to services, we are in keeping with 2020. The fact that we've signed less licenses means there are less services. It's too soon to draw any conclusions or detailed analysis because, as I was saying, we're -- in terms of revenue, we're expecting a significant improvement in Q2. And then after that, we'll see.
So for example, with the service activity that you might have, for example, has this been impacted by COVID, canceled travel is this something that you might -- which might have a lesser impact in other regions like the U.K., for example?
Yes, we haven't really felt this in terms of the figures. Clearly, we are losing volume because of this, but this hasn't been reflected in the figures. And then obviously, with the markets in France or in the U.K., which are more -- which are less impacted from this point of view. We have had an impact for budget reductions, but we are in keeping with the results that we saw last year. So we haven't had any bad surprises with our first quarter. That's how I can answer for banking. And then for Q2, obviously, we're seeing an improvement confirmed in this area.
We have another question from Antonin Baudry from HSBC.
3 questions on organic growth targeted in 2021. First of all, how has the first quarter, has it been above your forecast? Are there any particular matters or areas that have worked better than what was planned? And then organic growth, return to growth in Q2. Do you have an idea of the level of growth that might be achieved in Q2 and the granularity for this growth with regards to other quarters? And then finally, even if visibility is reduced, if we -- if the current trends continue, is it possible to aim for the top of the range of organic growth targeted in 2021?
So I won't be making any comments here. Obviously, we have the different quarters, but I could say that the comparison that I reminded. So with aerospace and then obviously, with transport as well, starting in the second quarter. This should be playing out in the opposite way. So obviously, I'm confirming what we've said in our forecast. For 2021, 2 months ago, we said we're expecting a return to growth in Q2. It's too soon to be giving you any guidance quarter-by-quarter. Perhaps in the next quarter, midyear, we will be able to do so. But once again, we're seeing more activity, but I am cautious. Obviously, we're looking at the situation very closely, especially in the private sector. Public sector is obviously carrying on. But we're seeing a driving force here, but we have to be cautious in terms of the private sector, and we have to react to all the different scenarios. So that would be my overall comment. I can't give you detailed figures, but that's what we can say at this stage.
And then just a follow-up with Sopra Banking Software now. With regards to the performance in the first quarter, could you let us know what you expect for the year? If you have any specific comments and then just the way we finished the quarter?
So we know that there's lots of transformation conducted at the same time. I've obviously explained this at the start of the year. No changes here with regards to the targets we've set ourselves. We have our context on our key priorities. We're very much focused on this digital layer, this common digital layer, which goes across our core banking systems. So all of our core banking products here, we're going to open them up more and more, open them up to the digital world and use this layer more and more. Obviously, more and more business domains are covered in the long term. So this is what we're working on. There's a lot of investment, all at the same time. We're transforming our R&D. We're pushing in India. And this is obviously that's going to take a couple of years here now to roll out this transformation. This is important and also it's what we want to do, but we have to do everything in order. So we're managing lots of transformations all at the same time and then we're obviously transitioning from a license model to more of a subscription model. Obviously, this impacts our priorities and the changes we're going to be making. So with this rationalization, clarification of our offers, but broadly speaking, these are the transformations that we're rolling out all at the same times. Obviously, we've acquired 8 to 9 companies now in a relatively short time frame. So there's rationalization and standardization which is underway. And we're pushing quarter-on-quarter. This is very much the priority. Obviously, we're looking at our capacity in our long term. So our capacity to increase the level of margin, that's why we're doing all of this. We're convinced we can do it, but we're not putting ourselves under too much pressure in the short term. So this is the plan that we're following, the plan, which obviously hasn't changed since my last comments at the end of February.
Now we have another question from David Marcon from ODDO BHF. Actually it's Nicolas David from ODDO.
So I'm not aware that Derric has been recruited, does he? So I'd like to come back to -- on finance question with regards to the surprises in Q1. You were surprised by lack of activity. We're talking about volume or prices, which were perhaps under levels planned. And then for the month of April, I think it's continuing this way, or is there potentially a negative inflection point? Or are there some sectors which are currently impacted? Obviously, I know you don't want to talk about Q2, but 3% of 2019 quarter in -- 2019 in Q2. When we look at these comparison basis, obviously, it seems easier. But we start to see perhaps the growth could be around 10% in Q2. And then is there any other -- are there any other factors that we've seen -- obviously, we've seen defense as a ramp-up here. We'll see the impact of this in the second half. Are there any other things that might slow things down that we need to bear in mind, obviously, in addition to the activity that you've spoken about? And then a technical question. Is there a calendar effect due to the number of working days?
So in the first quarter, I'll start with this one. So less 1 day on the French market, Q2 is better. And then I think second half is stable. So less in Q1 and then better in Q2. Broadly speaking, though, with regards to the contact, I mentioned this earlier, obviously, public is continuing. No surprises here. It's a driver. And then with regards to the rest, the industry sector in the broader sense of the term, perhaps we need to look at that more closely. And perhaps we might see trends change or we have to be cautious here. Obviously, we've chosen to be in this market, obviously, with Airbus, with aerospace, Airbus, we struggled here but was nonetheless a good choice. And then with the industrial sector, we're very present as well. If we talk about Airbus, then yes, anything can happen. We know that the aerospace market isn't an easy market. There might be a second savings plan, but I can't really answer you. I don't think it will be at the same levels as what we experienced last year, but I can't make promises. I can't promise you that we've reached the low point. But for several quarters now, activity has -- so in terms of subcontracting, it hasn't changed. So against this backdrop, we're coming out of the game. We're looking like we're in a good position, but we are preparing for a potential new drop if the aerospace market continues to be difficult. In the other sectors, there's obviously contrast between business topics that our customers have been pushing and heavily investing in. These are the strategic projects. And then obviously, there's a contrast with other projects, so savings plans, rationalization. And that's why we have to target the right topics. That's why we have to have the right level of partnership. This is our corporate plan to have this positioning. And I think there's going to be some big contrast. Obviously, that's what's going to happen this year and the next year. So between different stakeholders, from 1 business sector to another, that's going to be contrast. This is -- but we're not going to see a breakaway like we saw last year. Obviously, we saw the effect of the locked down. Obviously, our customers, we ourselves. We've got a measure of the situation, and we're seeing less impact. If we take a step back, obviously, it's aerospace and transport, which have suffered, low level of visibility, but at the same time, more active. That's what I could answer. And then obviously, with a comparison basis, obviously, all the analysis have been carried out. Obviously, if we're not heading in the right direction in terms of the comparison, we're going to push in the right direction now. No changes. No changes would like it to go up, but it's not going down, but it's too soon to start drawing conclusions about the past couple of months. I think there will be differences from 1 business sector to another, from 1 customer to another.
And then just 1 question. Do you think you can increase your market share coming out of this crisis, perhaps in the different geographies? Is there anything you can say from this point of view?
I think same applies here. It's too soon to draw any conclusions. We're not all present in the same sectors with the same customers in the same geographies. So obviously, it's interesting to analyze the situation country-by-country for comparable business lines. I think conclusions, we can draw them in a couple of quarters or a couple of semesters, but it is too soon right now. And so I prefer to wait a little bit before we make this type of analysis. I don't think we're losing market share. In any case, from what I'm seeing. We're seeing good momentum. But I wouldn't go so far to say that we're gaining significant market share in various areas.
We have another question from Gregory Ramirez from Bryan Garnier.
I just wanted to come back to solutions activity, Sopra's SBS and then the other solutions. Could we have some more details on the changes in turnover within these operating units? So for example, with SBS, between the platform and then amplitude and then specialized lending, and then clarification, obviously, when you're talking about EUR 60 million -- EUR 6 million compared with EUR 8 million in licenses, if those are the right figures. Sorry, I might have forgotten the figures. So for Q1, does this also include subscription? So I'm thinking about APAC. And then with regards to other solutions, what are the changes between real estate and then HR? Is BPO pushing in the HR domain? Is that pushing growth?
So for the first part of your question, we don't give this level of detail for product lines for all the geographies. I can just say that the trend between HR solutions and real estate, the 2 have generated growth and real estate a bit more than HR. For HR, organic growth, we were at 2% and then just under 6% for real estate. And then trends, obviously, growth on both sides. For the rest of the year, that's how we see the situation and then for the question on SBS, the figure that funds, Vincent gave you doesn't include subscription. That was just a license that was the pure license figure for the quarter. Yes, pure licenses. So that's Sopra Banking Software only.
Okay. So perhaps no -- perhaps there are different changes with regards to subscriptions?
Yes, the trend is obviously that subscriptions are increasing and that licenses and maintenance are going down in the long term. Obviously, we know this phenomenon. We're accepting it, and we're working with this in a positive sense, obviously, in the long term, that's what's going to happen. But obviously, we should be cautious with regards to comparisons between quarters. If a deal is pushed back just a couple of days, then obviously, we need a bit more time to be able to analyze ramp-ups on one side and decreases on other sides. So I'm just waiting a little bit longer before I can be more affirmative in terms of these matters.
And then for Q2 with SBS, return to growth in turnover, does this also regard services? Given that there was a latency, obviously, between the license sales a year ago, will services restart? Perhaps they're running late with regard to licenses.
Yes, obviously. Obviously, I said there will be a clear improvement. So indeed, obviously, if we have growth in Q2, that's very good. But obviously, there is this balance between services, licenses, maintenance subscriptions, which obviously we look at closely. I don't have any specific comments about that. But with regards to the -- Q2 will be better when compared with Q1, but obviously, services. Obviously, they restart just after licenses. So we've seen a difference here. But obviously, we need more analysis before we can give you a detailed vision.
We have another question from Laurent Daure from Kepler Cheuvreux.
So I've got couple of questions. My first, I just wanted to talk about your comments on the environment, lack of visibility. Is this a reference to the aeronautics and transport sector? Or what's your positioning with regards to orders and invoicing for the year? Things down when compared with 2 years ago, for example. Could we have a little more granularity with regards to these contracts? Then I have a question with regards to the U.K. If I'm not mistaken, in Q2, we had a strong drop in certain activity here. It looks like things have restarted this year. So what can we expect -- can we expect a strong Q2 in the U.K.? And then still with SBS obviously, without going into the granularity by quarter. Is your goal to have some growth this year? Does that still apply with the start for 2021?
Okay. So just to be precise here, obviously, I will put this otherwise. The situation is improving. I am confirming this. We haven't had any bad surprises over the last 2 months. Our portfolio of deals is improving. Business vision and forecast are improving, but at the same time without precise factual concrete -- factual information, I remain cautious with regards to the changes that I don't know now, but the changes that may come along, that's what I was saying. So if we just analyze the figures, everything that we've got from forecast or what we're signing in portfolios, there is an improvement. So we can be more positive. That's what I would say. But I'm not excluding any market changes, as I was saying, in various sectors, without a doubt, aerospace more than others. There always might be cost saving plans with our major customers, and this is difficult to plan and quantify.
So in Q1, how much Airbus represents what turnover?
I can give you these figures full year. We're at EUR 330 million in 2019, EUR 250 million last year. But obviously, there's the full year figures. So we've lost about EUR 100 million. That's what you should take away over the full year for Airbus. And so obviously, compared with the new pace that we have, that we've adapted to, at this stage, there are no alerts. We're fully employed. We've been able to adapt. There are no concerns with regards to these volumes. If it might drop in the future, then obviously, we'll be able to adapt. I don't think it will do like not at the same rate as what we've experienced previously. But I just want to be cautious with regard to this context. So once again, it's more a feeling rather than a concrete analysis, which comes from our forecasting systems. Just to be more precise. And now I've forgotten the other questions, the U.K., so Q2, yes, we're expecting -- obviously, Q2 last year, in 2020, we had the Visa, which slowed us down. So this is going to -- this had an effect, but now volume is looking good, but it's difficult to give you a forecast. I don't know if the volume -- the significant levels of volume that we're seeing in Q1, which will carry on in Q2. We don't know if that's going to carry on, especially in the second half. I think we have to remain cautious. But we are seeing positive overall trends. And then obviously, the contract with the Ministry of the Defense and then SSCL, pushing in Q2, less so in Q3 because it's been over a year now, but we are expecting good growth in the U.K. in Q2. And then last question was SBS for the full year. So over the year, we've got no changes here with regards to what we planned, what we'd announced at the start of the year. Obviously, there are deals. I was saying, perhaps the climate is slightly more positive but really plenty of nuances here, uncertainty with regards to licenses or some deals which might be decided on this year or not. So there aren't really many changes in either direction with regards to what we said at the start of the year. That's what we can say at this point. So it's not particularly reassuring, but it's not worrying. We've kind of got the same context.
We have another question from Derric Marcon from Societe Generale.
So sorry, just to come back -- sorry, I'm coming back to questions now. Just a couple more questions. So the first question, just a detailed situation. Have you had a positive impact because of the holidays in the first quarter? Perhaps the rate at which holidays were taken was different compared to last year. So has that been positive for you? And then for the Ministry of Defense in the U.K., EUR 60 million. So 3 quarters where we're seeing a boost and then we're seeing perhaps a boost of EUR 20 million in Q2, but then not over Q3. So is this playing out over 2 quarters or 3 quarters in 2021?
So broadly speaking, we started in June for the Ministry of Defense. So it's not as strong in terms of impact in Q2 2021. But we're going to have 2 strong months. So for the details, I've said basically everything that I had in mind. I don't know whether Étienne. Yes, so the contract in the U.K., we will basically -- we will -- very little growth at this point last year. So strong growth in Q2. Q3, Q4 were equivalent last year. So those are the impacts. Then with regards to holidays, we haven't had a significant impact, no significant impact to report at this point.
And then more general questions now, migration to the cloud. Today, are you seeing an acceleration, are you seeing your customers complicated applications that are migrating towards the cloud? And do you have an idea? Do you -- are you going to preserve your positioning infrastructure? Is this something that's going to enable you to win application transformation programs or modernization programs? So the migration to the cloud. And then the next question was on business strategy, commercial strategy, very much focused on specific customers. So some strategic customers have obviously been struggling. Have you looked to see if some of these strategic customers can be replaced by others? Or have you looked at your commercial portfolio over the next might there be some which are more promising than others over the next 3 to 4 years compared with other customers that are suffering.
So an important question here. Yes. Infrastructure management is the heart of our project, and I'm confirming that it's a strength more and more, not necessarily with a huge run volume, but obviously, a lot of expertise we have to support our customers. I just want to remind you that if they're moving to the cloud, it's not just for cost reasons, it's also for agility and time to market reasons. So if we're launching a new business easily, obviously, we have this capacity to adapt our information systems to new businesses. If I want to go into another business, I can transform. So we don't want to have limitations. This tunnel effect over several years, which obviously conditions launch or changes in business models, which are going to change quicker and quicker. And this obviously applies to all business sectors. So transformation and go to cloud incorporates this. So this transformation goes behind it so that we can natively integrate new applications or start-ups for others. Is this flexibility, which is expected, this is why we are upholding our target, having this end-to-end approach advising leaders, starting with consultancy right through to the run. This is what our customers expect. If we want to be a partner, then this is what we need. Otherwise, then it is not in the running. But not just any infrastructure, obviously. We've changed our positioning, and we carry on reinforcing ourselves. So with more consultancy experts, which obviously have a full command of this journey, and we're going to carry on heading in this direction. That is very clear. This applies to all our service activities. It also applies to software because obviously, subscription, SaaS models, obviously, expectations of these models are very different, and this is obviously pushing infrastructure as well. So I don't think we've made a mistake here. I think we're going to carry on pushing, reinforcing ourselves in this domain. With regards to the choice of our major customers and our targets. So it's a very simple focus strategy. We do this across the different geographies. When I was saying before industry, obviously, we can't be there. We can't be #1 everywhere. So with Airbus, for example, we're a major player with them. But for the rest of the industrial market, we've got interesting positionings in digital, R&D, and thinking about the automotive market, but these aren't huge volumes. And we consider that if we're successful with our top 100 customers, and we'll be successful at group level. So what happens if one sector is struggling, well, our analysis is quite simple. When we're going to be top 2 player for all of these 100 customers or so #1 or #2, unrivaled, vary with a strong presence. We'll ask ourselves questions. But actually, when we look at the situation today, we've got a lot of customers in this list, where there is room to grow. We're not yet in the top 3. We've got an interesting position, but obviously, we can clearly do better. And so obviously, there's a war on talent. In the long-term if you provide your customers with the best teams and you work together over a long period of time, it does pay off. So if a customer is suffering, it's not an issue. We can reassign our teams, and this is what we do. We ask ourselves questions every year. We've got 100 major customers today. In France, it's about 25. When we can expand this, then obviously we will up to 30 in France and then 115 at group level, and same for the other geographies. We will remain focused. So we still have this focus strategy. And I think for a player like us, this is what has helped us generate our growth network for a long time now, and this has contributed to our success.
We don't have any other questions for the time being. [Operator Instructions] It would seem we don't have any other questions.
Okay. So if there are no other questions, I'd like to thank you all for listening, and I will see you all very soon. Have a great day, and see you soon once again. Goodbye.
Ladies and gentlemen, the conference has finished. Thank you very much for taking part. You can now disconnect. You can log off. [Statements in English on this transcript were spoken by an interpreter present on the live call.]