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Photon Energy NV
WSE:PEN

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Photon Energy NV
WSE:PEN
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Price: 7.78 PLN -0.26% Market Closed
Updated: May 25, 2024

Earnings Call Transcript

Earnings Call Transcript
2022-Q3

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G
Georg Hotar
executive

Welcome to the presentation of the Photon Energy Group of our results for the third quarter of 2022. Together with Clemens Wohlmuth, our CFO, who is to my left, will be going through the presentation. Thank you very much for your attendance today. And we will start with a recap of an explanation of our business model. We'll talk about our strategy and outlook and Clemens will then walk you through the financial results for the third quarter of this year, which I assume most of you have already seen. So this will be good news. And as usual, we'll just start with a very brief introduction to those who may be new to our company. So we've been in business since 2008. We are a Dutch holding headquartered in Amsterdam.

particularly over the last 12 months, we have been expanding our teams globally at a very rapid pace. So we have now reached the milestone of around 200 employees. We are active in over 10 countries. Our shares are traded on the regulated market of the also in the Price Stock Exchange as well as the open market of the Frankfurt Stock Exchange. This year, we have seen 3 brokerages pick up coverage of our stock. And last but not least, we have in 2021, undergone a sustainability rating with IMO, which is one of the leading third-party rating agencies in relation to ESG and received a very good rating. And so this is our issuer rating. But as most of you are aware, we have also placed our green bond in November 2021, which we recently tapped again and that has also received the second part of the opinion from IMO, that's why it's classified as a green bond. We have 2 business lines, one in solar. The other one is water. The key numbers on our solar business line is that we have currently around 900 megawatts of projects under development. We've built over 120 megawatts of which the vast majority was for our own proprietary portfolio, which currently stands at 91.9%. At this point in time, another 28.3% are under construction in Romania. So -- and I read an advanced stage, so we will start commissioning them in the near future, which will take us well over the 100 mark and to around 220. In 2021, we generated 103 gigawatt hours of clean electricity, which is a number that we actually matched in the first 3 quarters of this year. So we have landed almost exactly 103 gigawatt hours. So for the full year, we expect to exceed 120 gigawatt hours. And in terms of operation and maintenance, we're currently servicing 380 megawatts of PV power plants, which includes our 91.9%, but also a growing number of external customers. In our water business line, we focus on lake management, which is the treatment of surface water bodies, rivers and lakes, mainly. And we work on the life cycle management of water wells with utilities. And then we have our nonremediation business line with a particular focus on the remediation of groundwater from various types of contaminants and the one that we are most excited about is our technologies apparent ability to break down PFAS chemicals in groundwater more on that a little bit later. Our footprint is Central Eastern Europe, which means Czech Republic, Poland, Hungary, Slovakia and Romania as well as Australia, where we've been present since 2012. So now since 10 years. As mentioned before, our pipeline stands at around 900 megawatts spread across Australia, Hungary, Poland and Romania. There'll be a more detailed breakdown later. Our pipeline of sorry, our portfolio of power plants includes 50 megawatts in the Czech Republic, 10.5% in Slovakia, 51.8% in Hungary and 14.6 megawatts in Australia, and obviously, Romania as a new jurisdiction in which we own and operate power plants in our portfolio will be added shortly. And O&M, there has been some additional, some growth in our O&M segment since the end of the second quarter. And as we so we've grown to 380 megawatts. And from what we can see, we can we expect a lot more times in this segment over the next months and quarters. As you can also see from the map, there are in certain areas and services, mainly around the inverter maintenance. We actually have a euro-wide customer base. And also our technology distribution division is winning customers outside the immediate region that we cover with our offices strategy and outlook. So the key to the strategy drivers for our company are and are expected to be, first of all, to increase our electricity generation volumes, which is a function of our installed base. And the fuel for that is a pipeline of projects. So we continue developing the pipeline that we have, and we're constantly looking for new project opportunities in our target markets while we're keeping an open eye on opportunities in new markets, whether they be neighboring to our current footprint and in some cases, also further field. Control of our own pipeline of projects is absolutely crucial. And at this point in time, there's way more capital chasing renewable in general and solar projects in particular.

And therefore, locking in those projects and controlling them is absolutely vital so that we don't have to go out and compete in the market for ready-to-build projects, which, of course, in general, tend to be sold to the highest bidder. So we're coming much earlier. Well, whatever we can, we generate in-house or we codevelop in some specific cases, we also are open to buy projects that have been fully developed by others and are ready to build as long as the numbers make sense. We are also increasing our capacity to address the exploding demand for EPC services, so for the construction of turnkey PV installations or power clients. So across utility scale, but also in the fast-growing behind the meter segment, that means for the consumption of the generated electricity on site, we are currently increasing our capacity across all our markets. operational maintenance, I already briefly mentioned before that we have seen some dynamism and we expect it to continue as our strategy to position ourselves across the CEE region as an experience, transparent and highly bankable on provider starts bearing fruit across all 5 markets in the CEE region.

So in all these 5 markets, we are on the ground, we have our own technicians with the exception of Poland at this point in time, everywhere we have our own assets. And we can see that the perception of the importance of operation maintenance is growing, and we believe that we'll see some very interesting dynamics over the next couple of quarters in terms of megawatts under management. And as this business is about scale, growing our scale is a slightly importance. Then we have technology, which is our technology component procurement are, but at the same time, also a distribution business, where we import modules, inverters, and over the last 12 months, again, with a very encouraging dynamism also batteries directly from the manufacturers. The vast majority I think based in China, and we distribute those to other EPCs sometimes developers who want to realize the projects they develop themselves, but to a very large degree, to small installation companies addressing various market segments from households, all the way to medium and large scale behind the meter installations. So this segment, as you'll be able to see when we discuss the quarterly financials have grown very, very dynamically this year. And but we believe that there's still a lot of headroom in the CEE region that we mainly target and, as I mentioned before, we also have we are also winning customers that are based outside our immediate footprint.

Last but not least, FortumWater, where we see very encouraging developments in relation to the success of our nanoremediation technology in addressing PFAS chemicals. And it appears our technology is able to break down PFAs Chemicals on the ground. There's been very positive developments in our pilot project in Australia, and we do expect next year to move to the commercialization of that technology, which offers us a global market opportunity. A very important part of our strategy is that we have switched at the end of last year, at the beginning of this year as much as we could of our installed capacity to the merchant model, which means that we are selling electricity in Europe into the daily head market in Australia into the spot market and basically become a price taker in the energy markets. So we have not signed any power purchase agreements where ever there is a subsidy element like in the Czech Republic, which has so-called green bonus, which means we're still receiving the investment subsidy element from whenever the support scheme was awarded, which is 2009 and 2010, but we are keeping ownership of the electricity and selling them into the market. In Slovakia, we have there was no possibility to opt out. So we continue receiving the feed-in tariff in Hungary, where we could we opted out of the feed-in tariff arrangements in the card metal schemes. There is in both for both these schemes, there's a possibility to return back to the feed-in tariff after a period of 12 months. We opted out as of April 1. So after April 1, 2023, we can return at any point in time. However, given market situation at the moment, we expect to remain in the market for an extended period of time and actually looking at the pricing curve and just maybe a few words on this chart. So at the beginning of this year, market prices were at this lower level as of the end of October already after a decline compared to the August peaks, which saw energy prices at levels of EUR 500 or more.

We are still well above the level, for example, of the Hungarian feed-in tariff, which is at the moment around EUR 85 and as you can see here, we take as a reference the baseload price curve for the driven market, which is the most liquid in terms of futures trading on the EX and LipoxiAnd for 2032 at the moment, price expectation the price level is EUR 116. So the message is clear. The market expects prices to stabilize at significantly lower levels than where they are today. However, a return to the levels of EUR 50, EUR 60 that we saw 18 months ago is not foreseen. And in the light of the current regulatory interventions in Europe and particularly the European Union's decision to cap prices for all renewables at the level of EUR 180. It is important to bear in mind that our levelized cost of energy of the power plants that we are currently in process of building and developing. And on the next slide, I will explain our technical approach is depending on jurisdiction between EUR 60 and EUR 70. So in Poland would be rather EUR 270, whereas in Romania and Hungary, where we have significantly more radiation. We are around the EUR 60 level, even at the recently increased cost of capital. And the levelized cost of energy, and that is very important already incorporates the project level cost of equity, both for debt and equity so this is the level of revenues per mega dollar that we need to achieve to cover all our costs, including our capital costs.

Anything above represents only an excess return. And so it's very clear that even that EUR 180, we are well above the level we need. So even if market prices continue coming down a bit and we end up at 150 or even 120 , we're still well in the clear in terms of our return requirements, so we've added this slide in order to explain a little bit more in detail what our technical approach is. So essentially, there are 2 ways how to build these scale power plants. One is on its fixed tilt. There's a fixed tilt installation, which is in Central Europe still prevalent, whereas in Australia or North America or other advanced markets, nobody today would even consider building a fixed tilt installation for utility-scale power plant. So we are building them on single-access trackers which in the morning are pointed to the east and leaving to the West. And wherever possible, we also overbuild these systems, which means that for every megawatt of AC capacity that we can feed into the grid, we install between 1.3 and 1.4 megawatt ounce of module capacity. And as a result, our so here on the left-hand side of the chart, you can see the difference between a south-facing system that is not a fixed asystem that is not overbuilt. You can see this balance shaped curve on a perfectly sunny day.

So this is what such a system would feed on the summer day into the grid. And you can see that with our technical approach, we start generating electricity earlier and significant amounts of electricity much earlier. when we reach full production in the system based on the overbuild of 30% to 40% could produce a little bit more than megawatts of this [indiscernible] so-called clipped by the inverters. So the system does not allow more than 1 megawatt here, it's 0.5 megawatt system. So then bit AC capacity that we allowed to inject into the grid. So the system does not produce more. But as you can see, we didn't provide for pretty much a significant part of the day, stable supply. So also the impact on the grid is significantly more positive than the [indiscernible] system. And the evening, again, we then produce longer and more significant volumes than with the fixed till system. And the noline as an overlay is the actual pricing curve on this year summer days in Hungary. So you can see but this is something that you see today in pretty much all energy markets, one significant volumes of renewable energy enter the market and particularly solar, you see the so-called tack curve. It's a little bit of fantasy one can see it back in this. So you have basically higher prices in the morning and the evening whereas around lunch time and in the early afternoon when traditional PV systems inject a lot of electricity into the grid. prices are relatively the lowest. And this is why with our system, we do not only produce and inject higher volumes of electricity, but also we achieved a significantly or materially higher revenue per megawatt hour as our production profile is more valuable. And this combination of factors, so a higher average revenue and higher volume leads to significantly higher revenues per installed capacity megawatts of installed capacity and also increase as a result of the higher volume also reduces our low adverse cost of energy. And this gives us the higher confidence level to be a price taker in the market, so is to go for the merger model. Strategically, we're not excluding signing power purchase agreements going forward. But if so, we want to do it with already operating power plants out of a position of strength. So what we're trying to avoid is the need to go and sign very long-term agreements with offtakers at fixed prices in order to secure project financing. As a result of a long string of discussions with banks that we work with, we've reached a point where we have a few banks that are willing to finance merging projects on attractive terms. So this is the way to go, and this is how we intend to expand our pipeline going forward. So a few words and update on our pipeline. So in Romania, compared to the last quarter and or maybe those of you who also look at our monthly reports, another one of which was published earlier this morning. You can see that in Romania, we have now moved to our pipeline quite clearly into the direction of construction. So at the moment, 28.3%. There's another 3.2% that will follow shortly. But also a significant part of the total pipeline has moved into advanced development. So it's fair to say that a significant part of that will be ready for construction in 2023. In Poland, where our approach has been to develop from scratch. And therefore, we have a relatively long development time, we're a little bit behind the development in Romania. But as you can see, around 30 megawatts have moved on. And also there, we expect some of those to be ready to build had to be built in 2023. In Hungary, we have now 3 power plants that are also approaching the realization phase, which may still start this year or will start early next year depending on weather conditions. And then there's another 22 that will also get ready next year.

And the 65 that you see in feasibility are projects slated for the capacity auctions. So we're not going to participate in any support scheme options. However, in 100 systems changed where now there will be an auction for grid capacity already incorporating the need to add storage. So 30% of the capacity of the power plant needs to be matched by storage. And that's something we are currently working on both in terms of technical but also financial aspects. But we have identified locations where we intend to develop projects under these new conditions. And this is as with Australia, where we have a 300-megawatt project under development based on the technology of region. So this is not a PV, the CaTV project, of which we have been involved in the development of over 1 gigawatt in the past. But we have decided already over a year ago to only develop ourselves projects that we utilize the region technology. And what Region has managed to do is to enhance traditional concentrated solar technologies in a way where the reflected and then concentrated sunlight from Mirafield in the receiver is not only harvested for its heat, but regions developed a PV cell that can be placed in this focal point that withstands the high temperature of around 700 degrees and through the phototyce effect instantly generate electricity. One the heat still gets captured. So this concentrate sunlight in essence, gets used twice. The heat gets captured and then stored in a hot water pool or a hyperinsulated hot-water reservoir is maybe a better description. Whereas the electricity generated through the PV cells is fully or partly used to Chill water in a second hyperinsulated reservoir.

So the temperatures are around 95 degrees, so just below the boiling point in the hot reservoir and 5 degree Celsius. So just above the freezing point in the quarter as well. And then on demand, when electricity is needed through an organic recon-cycle engine, which is actually a low-pressure gas turbine commonly used in geothermal power plants. Electricity is generated and supplied to the offtaker, which can be the grid, but the system also has the potential to be to be operated as an island, for example, to supply a remote mining or a community that is not connected to the national grid. And what is very important here is that the storage medium is water. So today, we see a growing concern among investors, but also lenders about the life cycle impact of batteries in terms of how the input materials are mined.

Of course, there are also geopolitical considerations and the environmental impact of the mining is still not fully completed the question how the recycling will work. And therefore, we believe that this approach to storage has a lot of potential and is finding a high level of acceptance. And so we have identified a location in South Australia and marine, where we are developing on currently 1,200 hectares. The footprint may be increased, a 300-megawatt power plant with a planned energy storage capacity of 3.6 gigawatt hours, so which would, at this point in time, make it the largest energy storage project in the world besides panhydro, probably by the time we will build [indiscernible], there will be something bigger, but it is a really significant project that is expected to have a very beneficial impact on the energy grid in South Australia. We've also received what is called Crown sponsorship, which means that the regional government is very keen to see this project move ahead.

We are currently still in the development phase and expect to have the project fully permitted. So from a technical point ready to build by the end of 2023. And at the beginning of next year, we will start working on the financing of this project, reaching out to potential equity and debt partners. Region itself is currently in the process of completing and commissioning its first full-scale pilot project, which has 4 megawatts of generation capacity and 50 megawatt hours of storage. The generation side is already operational and already supplying electricity to the grid. And the second part, the storage part is expected to be finished and then the whole plant commissioned in the first quarter of next year, which, of course, is a very important milestone and which will also help us in getting to financial close oar of our project and so we haven't skipped so in terms of financial guidance, I will start with our 2024 targets, which we communicated in mid-2021. So the goal by year-end 2024 is to have our proprietary portfolio grow to 600 megawatts, which is a significant stretch. However, it is matched by our pipeline. And of course, it requires a significant acceleration over the next 2 years. And I think it makes sense to point out that this will be more of a hockey stick than a linear line leading to those 600 megawatts. At that point in time, year-end 2024, we also want to have a project pipeline of 1.5 gigawatts, which we would assume will also have a significant share consisting of raging projects. And what I forgot to add is that in Australia, we are currently looking for additional locations for region power plants, but we're also starting to look at locations in other jurisdictions that have the required irradiation conditions. for our O&M business, our goal is to reach 1 gigawatt, which will include our portfolio and external. And that we believe is a number that we can achieve comfortably. We also have published our target EBITDA for 2024 in relation, which we back then put in relation to our 2020 results. So it was envisaging a 5x increase of the EUR 8.4 million that we achieved in 2020. In '21, we grew to 9.6%. And here I switch over to our current year guidance, which at the beginning of the year, we gave at the level of EUR 65 million for consolidated revenues and EUR 18 million for EBITDA.

And after the publication of the half year results, we increased that to EUR 85 million and EUR 24 million, respectively. And so a few quick comment to what Clemens will be presenting. So we are almost there in terms of the EUR 24 million. So we have reached 22.8%. If I look at the 12 months rolling, so including also the fourth quarter of last year, we are almost at EUR 24 million. And so we've made a significant move in that direction. And of course, it's important to say that our guidance for 2023, we will most likely publish with the publication of our full year audited full year results for 2022. But of course, we will strive to continue closing that gap between where we started in 2020 and the target for 42, having really closed a significant part of this year. I think what's also important is the equity ratio. So we have pledged. And actually in our green bond conditions, it's even a covenant that we maintain an equity ratio above 25%. At the moment, we are around the 30% level. And so all this development and growth is happening and must happen in the financial ratios. And so this is where I hand over to Clemens to present good news.

C
Clemens Wohlmuth
executive

Thank you, Georg. Once again, also from my side, good morning, and thank you for your interest and participation. Here, I'm in a very happy position today to present you our Q3 2022 financials and the year-to-date numbers, which are the best numbers in the company's history. So it makes me very happy and proud to be here today. Before I go into the numbers, just let me give you a short wrap up what happened in the last quarter and in the short period afterwards. We announced we started the construction of 7 power plants in Romania with a combined capacity of 28.3 megawatts already.

You can see here on the right side, a few pictures where we show you the progress of those projects. So they are commencing quite well, and some of them already modules are fully installed whereas others are quite installed or underway. And we will still commission and connect and commission the first of those power plants this year, not all of them as we originally intended, but they will start going online and then early next year, the rest will go online as well. in line with our financing activities, KFM has reevaluated our green bond continuing as attractive, even there is an increasing interest environment, still our 6.5% green bond was evaluated as attractive is 4 out of 5 stars.

We have prepared the bond step-up, which was also taken very well where we could place another EUR 12.5 million and increased it to EUR 77.5 million in October and now in November together. We have worked on the financing side also in the Czech Republic and refinanced our Czech portfolio, with UniCredit Bank long term, again and increased the liquidity status of the company, significant for future build-out. We also in parallel to that, repaid our old bond, the 7.75% corporate bond that was running since 2017 and which was due now on the 27th of October and it was fully repaid. This is the second bond. We have in our company history, repaid now fully.

So put adding another big milestone to our financial market presence. And what you will also see in afterwards in the Indian financials, and we will talk a little about it. I think also more from the Q&A side. About windfall taxes we are exposed, and we have mentioned this already last time, 2 windfall tax in Hungary with a few of our power plants only very limited. So 9.8 megawatts of the 1.8 megawatts are exposed to this excess tax we have to pay 65% on the excess between the feed-in tariff that we used to have and the newly generated revenues or price electricity price we get there, and this is also reflected in our numbers. From the KPIs, our power plant portfolio still connected is at 92 megawatts. So we have this 1.4 megawatt added in Hungary in May.

That number has not changed so far, but with the 28.3% under construction, this will be changing very fast and especially then for next year, a quite material impact on our electricity generation. Nevertheless, the electricity generation as such has increased from last year, the first 3 quarters to this year quite significantly to 103 gigawatt hours. Georg mentioned it before already in this 9-month period. So we have generated already the same quantity as we generated the full year last year. Only in Q3, we had 37 gigawatt hours produced compared to 34.7% a year ago. So also here a nice growth. But what is more important is what you can see these little marks on the right side on the bottom left graph about how much of this 103 gigawatt hours is merchant, 85.7 gigawatt hours were sold into the market merchant and only 17.3 gigawatt hours, which is basically our slower portfolio, a few power plants in Hungary, still 4 of them, which were sold based on a feed-in tariff. So there, we captured this high electricity prices that are out there in the market and therefore, could significantly grow our revenues. What I will show you on the next slide, which is our wonderful results for this quarter and the full year. So only in Q3, we could increase our total revenues from EUR 10.2 million last year by more by 247% to EUR 35.4 million.

So a significant growth also year-to-date from EUR 24.6 million last year to EUR 67.8 million across 175%. So a massive growth in the company. That growth comes from mainly 2 sources already, as we have announced or presented to you also in the Q2 results. One is clearly electricity generation. Here, even more at the moment from EUR 6.6 million last year in Q3 to EUR 15.5 million in Q3 of this year coming from the additional generated electricity clearly, but also more of that by the high merchant electricity prices compared to the feed-in tariffs. Now year-to-date, that number is also almost doubling to from EUR 164 million to EUR 31.4 million in revenues. Here, just also as a little how to say, to see that the history when we had last year for the full year, total revenues of about EUR 36 million we had in the first half year this year for the 6-month period, similar amount of some sort it, a little less than EUR 36 million. And now just in 1 quarter, we have EUR 35 million in revenue. So you can see the significant growth that the company has performed in this time from a revenue point of view. But that is not only the revenue has just grown significantly.

That goes directly into EBITDA where we have grown in Q3, our EBITDA from EUR 4.4 million to EUR 12.7 million, so a massive growth. And year-to-date from EUR 8.5 million last year in the first 9 months to EUR 22.8 million. As Georg just mentioned already before, this is just for the 9 months. So our guidance of EUR 24 million. You can see there's not much missing anymore. And if you take the rolling number, we are almost there already. So EBITDA-wise, a significant growth as well. That goes down to EBITDA, where we have you can the effect is even stronger now with from EUR 400,000 in Q3 last year to EUR 9.7 million. And from an overall negative EBITDA last year from minus EUR 91,000 to EUR 14.9 million, so significant growth, which also puts us on the net profit. We have announced this in Q2 already that we have returned the company positive. That effect is now continuing and getting even stronger from minus EUR 1.4 million in Q3 to EUR 6 million in Q3 this year. Year-to-date, EUR 6.6 million as net profit.

So quite sound numbers and also the total comprehensive income there, how to say, accounting adjustments in terms of potentially other comprehensive income from revaluation of our power plants to foreign currency translation differences, which have been actually negative in these periods now because of the weakening of the Hungarian foreign, Nevertheless, the overall result is still EUR 6.3 million for the year to date, which goes directly into our activity. When we look into the balance sheet, therefore, jumping to the equity. Our overall balance sheet has slightly grown to EUR 206 million. On the active side, this is mainly the fixed assets, which is our power plants that we have connected and that are generating electricity for us with EUR 143 million. Then we have some current assets of EUR 41.4 million is work in progress. And also our liquid assets than the matching part of around EUR 22 million that we had end of September. That was before the repayment of the Eurobond that was due in October then but also before the drawdown of the financing for or refinancing of our check portfolio. On the passive side, -- we have -- our liabilities were stable at EUR 112 million long-term or noncurrent liabilities, only slightly increasing short-term as well as EUR 36 million and a growing equity of EUR 58 million from EUR 51.5 million beginning of the year by 12.5% coming from the positive development of the company. On a cash flow point of view. And here, we have now, if you remember from the half year figures presentation that we had the cash flow fees turned into how it should be regularly in our business because of the construction start in the -- in Romania with those 28 megawatts so we show a positive operating cash flow that was negative before because of several advanced payments that were shown in operating cash flow still, which now go into investment cash flow or are covered by this here.

So we have, again, a significant negative investment cash flow, which is, in this case, a good thing from building the power plants that is increasing our future capacity to generate electricity. And we show a slightly still negative financing cash flow. Clearly, it comes from the repayments that we did in Q3 for our project financing that we had in place, plus we already early repaid or bought back a few bonds from the market, which is also then reflected as a negative finance cash flow that was then again overcompensated, we will present in the next quarter in October by the additional bond placement and the refinancing of the Czech portfolio. This is roughly the numbers in a nutshell. And then let me just, I think, finished here and can go through Q&A.

G
Georg Hotar
executive

So thank you, Clemens. So we received a few it's some very comprehensive questions. So we will try to address them efficiently in as much detail as we can. So the first one is what lifetime should we assume in LC calculation. So the answer to that is we're assuming 25 years. potential life spend is 30 years, probably more. So it's, of course, a question how well those power plants are built, how well they are maintained. But we believe with 25 years, we are reasonably conservative than what efficiency losses assumed after the lifetime. So I assume that this relates to the modules. So the modules have envisaged loss in efficiency of 0.4% to 0.5%. So basically, after 25 years and some manufacturers even prove these types of guarantees. The modules should still have about 80% or not less than 80% of the original capacities and manufacturers, even more for 85.It's a very long time into the future. So we will see. But basically, the efficiency loss should accumulated one until year '25 is in that range, 15% to 20%. And the replacement. Well, I think we believe that the main value of power plant, talking about this very long period is actually in the fact that we have a location and we have a great connection. So the long-term strategic value is in the grid capacity. And it may actually become feasible and makes sense to upgrade or power plants well within those 25 years simply because there will be more efficient modules. What is now becoming more and more of a topic is to add storage toward existing power plants. Definitely, that's a topic for new power plants. And so there is a lot of things to consider in relation to potentially repowering our upgrade, which probably is not so much a topic for the first 10, 12 years. But I think after that, we'll have to see where the technology will be after the next 10 years to make an assessment. But clearly, it's something that there is a regulatory issue related to regulatory issues related to powering. But I think there's a good chance that it will make sense to somehow amend upgrade the power plants before year '25. But what formats we don't know. So the next question is a very comprehensive one.

C
Clemens Wohlmuth
executive

So... Maybe I can... explain about electricity prices and the change of the electricity prices that we have showed in the presentation in our monthly reports between the different months in the different countries, so that there's a decrease in the Czech Republic from 1,000 to EUR 900 and EUR 700. In Slovakia, it's very stable with EUR 260 in Hungary, it's also decreasing from 460 to 117 million in Australia, it's from 100 to 86 to 97%. The reasons behind that are relatively simple. I mean the electricity market has the prices have gone…

G
Georg Hotar
executive

I'll talk about the structure because...

C
Clemens Wohlmuth
executive

Exactly. Exactly..

G
Georg Hotar
executive

That number of combination includes also the green ones, which is about EUR 560 in [indiscernible] . So what we show is the total revenues. So it's the EUR 560 million plus whatever we achieve in the market.

C
Clemens Wohlmuth
executive

Slovakia is a pure feed-in tariff. So there we are not merchants. So this is not an electricity price, but if a inter if we get there, it's a fixed amount. The difference is just because it's a little different between the power plants and it depends on how much each power plant produces. The amount is a little different than therefore, it's basically stable. And in Hungary, it is majority. There is only 4 megawatt of this 58 megawatts we have installed under feed-in tariff. Everything else is purely merchant. So this is pretty much really the development of the electricity price in Hungary that we could realize. Australia is a combination that we have electricity prices and the green or the large-scale certificates we get. So those both have market prices, and this is here as well then can be seen the development of those components, whereas the fluctuating part is the electricity price because these certificates are trading at a relatively stable price over that period. So this is the first to this. The second, I understand the company changed the guaranteed tariff to market prices from variety power plants. Yes, what are prices for each country at which it will be not beneficial anymore. To start simply in Hungary, we have the feed-in tariff is the amount of some at the moment, EUR 85 90. Roughly, it will be adjusted by inflation next year. It's paid in Hungary and foreign. So we will see what this number is. We can change back to the feed-in tariff from April onwards. So there's a retirement till that to make this decision, but it will be around 90, something around EUR 90 expected. As long as the electricity prices expected are above this. There, we are very flexible in changing back, so we can do this every month. We were tracking these prices very thoroughly. So as long as we're not going below this EUR 90, we will stay outside the feed-in tariff with those power plants. In the Czech Republic, it's a little bit more complicated because there is this difference between the green bonus scheme and marketing the electricity ourselves that we do today or the feed-in tariff, yes, the price difference is around 100 well, gross, it's EUR 160, but there is also a little difference in the solar levy and there are a few things there to be considered. We are monitoring that very closely as well, and we'll make a decision very soon because here, we have to make or file this decision until the end of this month for the full year next year. And then next year, we can choose again for 2024. So this is an annual decision that needs to be made under which regime we are running there. In Romania, our power plants that we are connecting now are purely meant to be merchant. So there is no feed-in tariff, and there's also no discussion about changing the approach. Same in Australia. There is no feed-in tariff. So those power plants can always generate electricity and sell it on the market or we might go for some, as Georg mentioned before, power purchase agreements.

G
Georg Hotar
executive

So then the last part of this question is what our plans are for next year to repeat our B2C's revenues. So first of all, it's also important to note that prices have been fluctuating all of this year. So it's so of course, in October, we had this almost EUR 500, if we take the Hungarian numbers, but that was not the case for the full year. So in the first quarter, for example, in Hungary, we're still in the feed-in tariff. And there were also months when it was not it was not universally high. August was, of course, a month with a lot of production, so that helped. But so we believe that average prices next year will be lower, but it doesn't necessarily have to be dramatically lower than what we achieved average this year, but what will have a significant impact is our large installed base. So we have our around 30 megawatts that we in Romania that we expect to add, there will be more following in Romania. There will be more power plants in Hungary. So as they come online and start contributing, we believe that will more than offset the whatever the decline will be in average prices. So it will depend on a few factors. What we can influence is the speed of our rollout, and that's what we are focusing on at the moment. So we are so the important message here is these were extraordinary circumstances this year that this have helped us on a more or less stable on the slow growing asset base to increase our profitability dramatically. But it's not a one-hit wonder. So with the increase in asset base, but also the development of other business lines, we expect to be growing from here onwards. And but what is important, I think what has been shown this year is the strong operating leverage in our business. So while our cost base as we grow is growing, the positive impact of clearly adding new capacity, adding new power plants to generate electricity and sell where each power plant has an EBITDA margin of 90%, 95%. So at the margin, we get a new EBITDA that has a strong tendency to flow down the P&L all the way to the bottom line. And I think that has become very visible this year, and we believe that we'll become even more visible as we grow our business. There is the next question is a question about water business line, which we have been talking about for quite a lot, in particular the pilot project for PFS remediation in that we have in Australia with the Department of Defense. The implementation of that pilot has been delayed beyond our expectations due to various reasons, one of them COVID, but also some right tapes. Australia is quite bureaucratic in many, many respects. But what we can say is that in summer, we started injecting the material, and we are collecting data the results are very encouraging. And there was a question whether the impact would be visible in the next couple of months in term in our finances. So probably I wouldn't go that far, but I think we will be talking about our remediation activities a lot more often. And I think as I said before, that our expectation in case that we will start commercializing so moving beyond the pilot project stage next year. And the market potential is global, it's significant. It's actually growing as more and more countries are adopting regulation and reducing limits for PFAS chemicals. So this is a real low option that we will, of course, try to track a tap. And we believe that we have the right technology and also have -- in -- with this pilot project, the right stage where to actually improve the technologies efficiency.

Then there is a the next question is about delay in our development was reflected in the speed at which projects move through the 5 stages that we are publishing to the market. Well, I mean, that's a general issue with I mean in our main project pipeline, we now don't give we don't publish any more target dates for ready to build, which we did in the past against which we quite a few times, had delays. I'll start with the Strati project, we announced that we should expect to be ready to build the end of next year. That's the time line we still stand by. And of course, always driving to be faster, but there are certain things or kind of influence. But in general, project development is not an exact science. It's -- there's a lot of -- it is an art and then Art is putting together all the components necessary to go through the development process, things are under control, others not. Of course, we are trying to get the projects ready to come as quickly as possible. And through our setup week, what is very important is that the moment they are ready to build from a technical point of view, we move on to the implementation. And we actually already -- when we see that the project is getting close, we already start the procurement for those components that have longer lead times so that we move as quickly as possible from a technically ratable project to an operating power plant. But in the development phase, we have our plans, but [indiscernible] goals if you want to make good live-show in new plants. So we're trying and we're, of course, trying to move quickly. But and sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. So -- but I think we are now with the development in Romania and also the progress we're making in Hungary. I think it's very clear that 2023, beyond the 30 megawatts that we're currently in the rounder construction that we will have would be very, very busy in adding megawatts to our portfolio next year. Then the next question is how the Polish market is different than other markets where we operate. And well, I think that the time budget I would need to talk about that, we'll go way beyond of how much time we've left it is definitely a market that is, in many respects, more complicated. So the highlights are that in all the markets that we have ever developed projects, you secure rights to the land, the next thing you do, you ask for great capacity also in Poland, you sign up a long-term lease or a pre-lease and then you spend time, effort and money on environmental permits and the zoning decision, which is it takes about 5 months, cost a few thousand lots. And only then you can ask for great capacity and then you have to wait to pay a deposit, which most other countries we also don't have. And then we wait up to 5 months and actually most years all so far have taken the full 5 months. So basically, before you know that you have great capacity, we've already done quite a lot of work committed capital and almost 1 year older. So also that's tricky. The other issue that we have in Poland as opposed to Hungary, Romania is that at this point in time, it appears to be a very few exceptions that the DSOs do not allow overbuild. So we're having constant discussions and we're pushing that allow us to overbuild. We understand a few other developers are pushing for that as well. But so far, with very limited progress. And that means that the levelized cost of energy is higher than the other markets, not only because of the lower production, but also because we don't have this additional boost through the overbuilding. So I think as Poland wants to further develop its renewable capacity, there's quite a few things that can that could be approved in Poland itself. But we believe that will happen in the future. And of course, there are a few other topics as well, but these I think are the most important ones. The next question is what is the role of Photon Energy in the Australian project? So it's so I can Well, our role is that at this point in time, we are developing the project fully on our own for the region technology, where Region would be the supplier of, I would say, the key elements which is that overall technology provide engineering services, it provides the software that runs the system and the PV cells. Pretty much all the rest is procured from outside vendors. And of course, there's also the element of construction work is more significant than an average PV plant. So pretty much most of the rest. So in terms of value, less than 10% would come from region. But it's developed on the basis of their technology, their engineering input and there's a very close cooperation but the project at this point is our so there's a project company that Photonics fully owns that has signed the previous agreements for the land. So actually, it's we have the option to buy the land. So the option to acquire the land. And we are going on behalf of the project company we are working on the permit. So at the end of this process, there will be a project company that has right to the land, has the grid capacity has to get development approvals they call it in Australia and can develop the project. And our I mean there are several options, there's optionality here. One of them is that our Plan A would be that we bring in other equity investors and on the back of that debt financing. And we contribute to that project the project rights for what we would hope is a significant minority stake. But of course, if through that process of finding investors, an investor comes and loves the project so much that he wants to own it fully and offer those what they call a stupid check, we may consider. So our preference will definitely be to stay in the project as a minority investor or as an investor. But as we also develop other locations and want to have a pipeline of raging projects, maybe that vision to be an investor may be realized later on. So this is still open. The important thing is, and that relates also to the other pipe to the other the remainder of our pipeline and our credo is whoever controls the project right, controls everything else. And the important message here is we control the project. We control the situation. We choose who will be co-investing with us and in a form, so the average cost of building the plant Australian the region plant. Well, I think at this point, just to give a ballpark, the expected investment cost, given this current parameters is somewhere between EUR 450 million and EUR 500 million. So this is the expected ticket.

C
Clemens Wohlmuth
executive

Including the storage everything.

G
Georg Hotar
executive

That includes the storage sort of grid connection and everything. next question is where you can sum up any state actions that could cap your revenue or tax net profit in 2023. Well, it is, of course, a very, very dynamic situation. So it's sometimes very hard to keep track. So and but so I'll do it relatively quickly. So in the Czech Republic, there has been a cap on solar-generated electricity announced at EUR 180 per megawatt hour. -- valid from December 1 this year, all the way to the end of next year. So the EU Commission came out with end of June next year, the Czech republic went further. However, it's only for power plants above 1 megawatt. So we have 3 installations in our portfolio that are below, so they would not be subject to that. And it's not 100% tax, but it's a 90% tax. So 10% of what is above 180, we will still obtain. There's a windfall profit tax scheme as well for which how we do not qualify because it's for larger companies. In Hungary, at this point in time, as we mentioned, this is for electricity. So we still have this discussion about green bonus, which is yet…

C
Clemens Wohlmuth
executive

Kept or taxed and then this electricity part or going for the full feed-in tariff, which would also not be kept yes.

G
Georg Hotar
executive

So there's no impact on the support schemes. This is purely about electricity. Then we have Hungary, where so far, there's been no windfall profit tax amount directed at renewables, what stands at this point in time for this year and next year is what has been announced and implemented back in May, April of this year, which is a 65% tax on the revenues above the feed-in tariff level but this only relates to power clients that in the past have either obtained or actually or applied for a support scheme, which is and it only applies to power plants that have a license. That means they have a great capacity above 500 kilowatts. So as it stands today, and so far, there's no additional news in relation to that EU decision. Nothing would change. So it would impact about 20% of our portfolio. But again, only at the level of 65% above the feed-in tariff level, which at the moment is 85%, It would not apply to the rest. Things may be more coming, but this is where we stand today. And in Romania, there is actually a cap for solar power at the level of EUR 93 from the 1st of November this year until the 31st of August next year. So but what but it's actually an 80% tax above. So everything above EUR 93, 80% is kept as a tax and 20% is made available to the generators. However, there is also more that was passed in April this year, which stipulates that this cap or the solidity tax or 80% above 93%, does not apply to newly installed capacity, whether renewable or not. So on that basis, I think then today, there is this exception should apply to the power plants we are currently building and planning to connect next year. we'll see. Governments are creative these days. So but at the moment, there would be no there should be no impact. And which leaves us with Poland, where at this point in time, we don't have power plants. And I think this is now very recent. There has been a new law and also a new ordinance from the regulator, which indicates that power plants below and above 1 megawatt would have slightly different caps one for below 1 megawatt, PLN375 , which is EUR 79 and EUR 355 for those above, which is 74.6%, which corresponds with the level of the last auctions, I understand. But it's at the moment from -- this is really fresh. So a lot of legal mines have been scratching their heads over the weekend to figure out what's actually happening. So I think I hope we'll have some more clarity. But at this point in time, we have not built and operate any power plants in Poland. This has overimpact so this so the news is on the Czech Republic, it is definitely not threatening in Hungary at this point in time. We're not aware of anything any new regulation that would change the status quo as it applies has been applying this year, at least it's May. And in Poland sorry, and in Romania, at this point in time, our part we expect our power plants or our future power plants are exempted from these measures. Again, it may change. But if it remains like this, then, of course, this is this would be very positive. So I think what we can see, the picture we can see emerging is this 180 megawatt limit is not necessarily a hard limit. and certain pockets of exceptions may exist in various countries at various points in time. But again, we're talking about the Level 180 where the buffer [indiscernible]

C
Clemens Wohlmuth
executive

Good. The next question was to the green bond and just very quickly about the number of outstanding or the [indiscernible] it's just the green bonds for 21 in [indiscernible] almost week to week. What is currently the amount of green bond outstanding 21,27, and whether you plan to increase it, if yes, to what? Well, our green bond, yes, has changed. It was originally EUR 50 million last year. Then we increased it in line with the original placement with EBRD 255 because of the strong demand. And in May this year, we increased it by EUR 10 million to EUR 65 million. Now we have done the with the exchange offer for the old bond plus a new placement. We added another EUR 10 million. So it is it was EUR 75 million. We already, at that time, intended to also have EBRD again, as a strong investor on board for technical reasons. This got delayed there EUR 2.5 million investment. Therefore, we did not announce it at the original placement on 14th of October but had to could only report it now almost a month later. This was because we wanted to be careful here and not overreport something which would be then settled later. So this is why there was these changes. So at the moment, we have an outstanding amount of EUR 77.5 million. Are we intending to increase that. I think at the moment, we could not make such a forward-looking statement.

Nevertheless, as a financing strategy, as we have announced in the past several times, financing, we are bond on the financial markets is one of our core pillars of financing next to project financing or long-term project refinancing, as we have done with the Czech portfolio recently, what we intend going forward with our Romanian assets, which we are as soon as they are connected. We want to refinance them as well. And for sure, we also want to go, if it's possible to financial markets with some fixed income product as well like this green bond is as long as it is.

G
Georg Hotar
executive

So I think maybe we have not stated that I think it's worth highlighting that with the recent actions, which means the repayment of the previous bond and the increase of the green bond, the refinancing of the Czech portfolio. In parallel, what we've also done is we have fixed the unhedged part of our project level financing. So today, essentially 100% of our financial debt is fixed. So any increase in and of course, the bond, which is the most significant number is due in 5 years. So at this point in time, it's fair to say that all our financial debt is as a fixed and known to us cost. Of course, going forward, should interest rates go up, that will be a topic for future project financing, the refinancings. But at this point in time, that was the home exercise for the last 6 months. to make sure that we have no loose ends in relation to the maturity structure, but also the cost of our financial debt. So that exercise has been completed. And I think let's just look forward quite confidently, the bond is a fixed instrument with our coupon of 6.5% at this point in time, probably, from our point of view, reasonably priced. So I think it's fair to say that it is one of the options that we have on the table to meet our future fining [indiscernible] needs. But as Clemens said, they all turn to our project financing and potentially a new instrument not thinking out over the next couple of quarters and years. So nevertheless keeping the 25%... Ratio is the foundry also to mention here in terms of refinancing. The next question is, could you shed more light on the trust of the spot. Just to become [indiscernible].so the next one is that we took advantage of the market, whether the falling prices are straight and whether that would allow us to increase in our revenues next year. whether the pace of delivering great build power plants is higher than that of other companies. and then basically a short what analysis of Photon. So well, I think partially, we answered that before already. So it's probably at this point in time, it's reasonable to assume that our average prices will be lower. But again, we haven't had those super high energy prices throughout the whole year. But probably, at this point in time, we have to assume it's going to be lower, but that will, as we believe, more than compensated by the new capacities that will come online in the next couple of weeks and then throughout next year. So if you talk about the total revenues from energy generation, we believe that we should be able to continue with the trend that has been established this year and that's upwards. But of course, there's a lot of moving parts. So it's very hard to predict at this point in time. Whether we are delivering power plants faster or slower than others, I don't know. I think in that respect, we are focused on ourselves. We don't care too much what others do. And yes, the focus is really on getting those projects ready to build shorten the time then from technical ready to build to commissioning by frontloading some of the procurement and making sure we are ready to build and commission the power plants as fast as we can. That's and we don't look very much left and right, what others do and we do more or less. So we wish them good luck in their efforts. what is important to us that we have the right assets, and I think I explained before that means that they are overbuilding track as wherever possible. The strength and the weaknesses opportunities and threats. So well, I think one of the now leaving aside the external environment in terms of market price development. So clearly, the expense rates are the market price development, although even when we look at the forward prices, even when we look at this cap that's nothing that is fundamentally threatening. I would still see interest rates as a potential threat, although now they have eased off the bit, but things can get worse again. So clearly, as we require outside project financing in a rollout that can have an impact. I think the geopolitical level an escalation of the situation between China and Taiwan would be a rather bad scenario, but I believe not affecting the supply chain, but not only for us, but that would really have impact well beyond the solar industries. And yes, of course, the unpredictable government, so now that the various governments try to tackle the situation and the response to these high energy prices we see different levels of sophistication and reasonableness. So but then again, we've been in this industry now for 14 years. We've lived through life threatening, retroactive measures taken by the Czech government back in 2010, which essentially almost killed us, we still survived. So today, as we are hedged, we are operating in multiple markets, partially also outside Europe. We believe that we are in a good position to weather that storm not at this point in time, I would still clearly strength. I would still look at the situation positively in the sense when we did our forecast in 2021 before our equity place impact then, we made our forecast based on energy prices of EUR 60. Now we have a situation where elected not elected [indiscernible] are capping us at 180 yes so it's still in a relatively secure a little bit holistically, it is I don't want to call it a luxury problem, but it's definitely not the level where we would have to feel tremendously threatened. I think in terms of strength, I think that the fact that we're a public company, we're very transparent. We can see that it's very helpful in securing financing that we have a very transparent partner. I think the fact that the EBA came on board as an investor in our bond is testament to that. But and I think we can also having a few banks lined up willing to finance our merchant project, which is a very new concept in Europe, in particular in the CEE region, I think, shows that we are accepted as somebody who can probably synthesize market trends and the technical solutions and as a result and I think it's also just a little big about us versus others. We don't believe that the number of megawatts and how quickly you grow and how many you add is necessarily the key parameter. I would strongly prefer 1 megawatt of our overbuild tracker power plants over 3 south-facing megawatts in the same market because it's much more valuable. So it's also about the net present value that you can actually create per megawatt. And so it's not only about a number of megawatts, but how well they are built and how competitive that asset is. And so this is why we really don't care what other people do in terms of number of megawatts in particular. So…

C
Clemens Wohlmuth
executive

Maybe also to mention generally, the integrated approach we are having that we are covering the full life cycle of power plants from the development to the construction to the investment and the long-term O&M, which and the procurement of technology, which has also in the past given us a lot of flexibility, plus that we clearly have under control what we own long term. I think also 2 opportunities, things you mentioned in between a little for sure, one of the biggest opportunities besides the growth of our solar business is with the technology from Region, which I think is unique in the company and very clearly, the water business remediation going forward is one of the biggest opportunities we see long term in the company. So... Could you talk...

G
Georg Hotar
executive

[indiscernible] Yes, maybe to this, I mean the trade receivables have increased clearly once in line with the growth of our revenues. So if you see this always relatively in the revenue view how it is growing. Plus there is clearly the effect that with the seasonality of our business in Q2, Q3, electricity generation is contributing much more. Therefore, at the end of the quarter, the outstanding amount is naturally much higher than in Q4 and Q1. But you will see, so this will automatically go down. As we have said or presented in the last time with the green bonus scheme, there is an additional effect to that, that there is part of this green bonus paid out only quarterly. So end of the reporting period, we have the full quarter for the full quarter, not only for the month, the amount outstanding. Nevertheless, as of today, these amounts have been collected with the growing merchant revenues in Hungary. There is also as of the end of the period, more outstanding asset, this goes along with the revenue growth. And the technology trading as well has increased significantly. So with this also the receivables went up. This is in line with the growth of revenues and has to will continue like that with the number of revenue. The next one was...

C
Clemens Wohlmuth
executive

Currency risk.

G
Georg Hotar
executive

Currency risk, yes. Well, there we have, on the one side, a certain natural hedge in our currency risk that basically we have financed originally our power plant always in the currency in which the revenue stream was. So in Hungary, Hungarian forint in Czech Republic originally in Czech koruna . Being merchant, there is a next layer coming to this because the electricity, even if it is sold in local currency, the underlying price is a euro-based price for electricity because it's within Europe traded in euros. So even if you get it paid out, it is linked to euros. We have changed now our financing that we have a combination of euro and local currency financing in both in the Czech Republic and in Hungary on those, we have secured the interest rate completely hedged. For the currencies, we have no extra hedging, respectively, we have a hedge on the Czech koruna financing on top as well, but more as a not how to say is a relatively broad bandwidth, so just as a security net in case of a disruptive FX activity happening. We feel comfortable with that level of hedging.

There is for sure a certain exposure, which we see as a risk that we are willing to cover by the equity part of the portfolio. But as said, as we see the only short-term exposure, we don't see this risk as too big at the moment. going forward? Well, I think the one last point I would like to make is that now on our new power plants, the financing will be in euros as electricity in Europe is traded in euros. And therefore, the banks considered even if we receive koruna's or foreign or lay physically at the end of the month or 3 weeks later the end of the month, they're linked to euro price... So in a short term example... Or repeats every month on that basis the within the finds in euros. And which, of course, at the moment, comes at the lower cost than financing in the respective local currencies.. Next question is, what effective realized electricity prices we assume for 2023 outside Australia, EUR 180 or less. So -- but I think it's very hard to say, as I pointed out before, with what we know today for our assets that we have in the case of Hungary, and we will be adding in Romania and Hungary, that there's no regulation in place at the moment that would cap us at 180. So if that's not the case, the prices remain higher. If we look at the forward prices that indicated, then we may end up at 10, if 180 were a hard cap, then I would say that I don't believe we'll get in every hour. And again, there's also a question how it's measured, whether it's for every hour, every day or every month, 180 is a cap -- so if it were for every hour, then definitely, we will not achieve 180. -- if it's per month, we may come relatively more closely. If in some parts of our portfolio, the cap does not apply or only partially like to 65% as we have in Hungary, then we may end up 49%. But I think the important thing is the key driver next year will be our increased capacity, and that's something we have under control and make sure it happens.

The next question is business...

C
Clemens Wohlmuth
executive

Trading business.

G
Georg Hotar
executive

Trading business... This Q4. Q3 was very strong. Well, I think what I would say is that Q4 this year in our trading business will be much stronger than it was last year. whether it was also the strongest quarter in the year, whether that will be repeated this year, I think is something we cannot say at this point. But it's definitely not only in Q4 now, but also into next year, we see significantly higher business levels than we have had in the past. And I mean, the boom continues. I mean a strong driver in batteries, where maybe now winter, the sales will drop off a little bit, but it's definitely at much higher levels than what we used to have.

The next question...

C
Clemens Wohlmuth
executive

Relations...

G
Georg Hotar
executive

That's probably in relation to newly connected power plant. So it will depend on what we will be able to commission in Romania before the end of the year was [indiscernible] to Q1. So that will be the main driver.

C
Clemens Wohlmuth
executive

Exactly. So what we commissioned this year still, we hope that there will be at least one project connected that will be then revaluated end of Q4. For sure, we also reevaluate or reassess our existing portfolio based on the parameters. Nevertheless, we don't expect here any effect as of today.

G
Georg Hotar
executive

Okay. And then next question, how many capacities should be commissioned in 2023. So here, I would say that well, we can't be specific. The 30 megawatts under construction already or one of those potlines nearly. Some of it will connect it this year so next. But when we think about really a new batch next year, I think I pointed out before that there is in Stage 3, quite a few megawatts in Romania and also Hungary. So that is the baseline whether given the current situation, we execute any projects in Poland remains to be seen. and but there may also be capacities added in other markets, which we cannot foresee at this point. But it will next year has to be a significant step towards our year-end 2024 goal of 600...

C
Clemens Wohlmuth
executive

Cool, I think then we are is the end of the questions, right? Thank you very much. [indiscernible] will be available online... all For you as well. And if there are any further questions, we, of course, are available at least at photonenergy.com. Please direct your questions to that e-mail, and we're happy to get back... Thank you very much. And wish you a great day. Goodbye. Thank you.