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Ladies and gentlemen, it is an honor and privilege to host Indian Railway Catering & Tourism Corporation Limited, IRCTC, for their Q4 and FY '21 Results Call. Representing the company, we have Smt. Rajni Hasija, Chairman and Managing Director; and Sri Ajit Kumar, Director, Finance and CFO. We would request Honorable Chairman and Managing Director to start the session with her opening remarks, post which we will open the floor for Q&A. Thank you, and over to you, ma'am.
Thank you very much. A very good morning to everybody. I welcome you all to this con call of IRCTC Limited for the quarter and the year ending -- ended on 31st March 2021. I hope that you and your dear ones are safe in this challenging times of COVID, which has affected each and every quarter of our life. Yesterday, our company had announced the audited financial results for the fourth quarter and the year ended of fiscal '21 and same has been disclosed on both the stock exchanges, too. We all know that the COVID-19, the pandemic, has had a severe impact on the Indian Railways operations and all our business segments. In fact, it has been the worst year for the tourism and hospitality business. However, despite all the headwinds and challenges, IRCTC has shown remarkable improvements in its operation and financial operations. That will be evident from our results. If we compare quarter 1 with quarter 2 and quarter 3 and quarter 4, there has been a consistent improvement. I shall now hand over the con call to our Director of Finance and CFO, Sri Ajit Kumar, who will provide you details of the quarter and year ended results for the fiscal 2021, post which we shall have a question-and-answer session with you all. Thank you.
Good morning, everyone. This is, of course, in the pandemic times whatever the best we have been able to achieve, so that we have tried. And these financial figures is here like this. The Q4 FY '21 revenue was at INR 339 crores and saw a sharp improvement of 51% quarter-on-quarter. On a year-on-year, it continued to face the headwinds of the pandemic. EBITDA margin came at 42.8%, which was another high and saw an improvement of about 60 bps quarter-on-quarter. On a year-on-year basis, the EBITDA margin was much higher than 34.4% in Q4 FY '20. Net profit before exceptional items was at INR 107 crores, which implies a growth of around 36% Q-o-Q and a decline of 29% Y-o-Y. For FY '21, revenue came at INR 783 crore, which is a decline of close to 66% Y-on-Y. And EBITDA margin came at 24.3% versus 31.4% Y-o-Y. And net profit before exceptional items came at INR 150 crore versus, of course, INR 527 crores year-on-year basis. Let me now move to the business segments of the company. The number one will be, of course, the star, the Internet Ticketing. Internet ticketing segment has been the most resilient business segment in these challenging times. The Q4 FY '21 revenue in Internet ticketing came at INR 212 crore. That is an increase of 48% Q-on-Q and decline of just 7% Y-on-Y. The EBIT margin for the segment also saw sharp improvement Q-o-Q to 30 -- to 83.3%. In Catering segment, as discussed in our previous earnings call, has been severely hit by the pandemic, while the revenue for the segment has been improving Q-on-Q basis, however it continues to be lower on year-on-year basis. For Q4 FY '21, it was INR 67 crore and then minus 75% year-on-year basis. As discussed earlier, this segment has seen restrictions like only ready-to-eat and no cooked food allowed onboard or sealed packed meals being allowed or meals to be ordered through e-catering versus the earlier one that is the precooked meals being served in the pre-pandemic era. However, the company has been able to reduce the losses both on absolute basis and EBIT margin levels. The next segment is Tourism segment. Of course, worldwide this effect is there -- that this has seen the most severe hit of the pandemic for us as well as for the industry. The Q4 FY '21 revenues were more than double Q-on-Q to INR 32 crore. It is still 80% lower than in Q4 FY '20. This has -- of course, had its impact on the profitability of the segment. Now Rail Neer, the next segment, has also seen Q-o-Q improvement throughout the year, I mean just after the moment we started unlocking, and so therefore, this earning started here. In Q4 FY '21, it's revenue improved by 64% Q-o-Q to INR 278 million. For Q4 FY '21, the CapEx was INR 46 crore. And for FY '21, it has been INR 73 crore. The company continues to have a strong balance sheet with a net cash of INR 1,460 crore and net worth of INR 1,466 crore. Q1 FY '22 has again seen the surge in COVID-19 infection, and the same has been brought under control. We've also seen significant improvement in vaccination. However, the third wave of infections and the impact of same still remains uncertain. At IRCTC, we will fight the tough situation as we have done in FY '21. And I'm confident that we could come out of it even stronger. We can now move to the question-and-answer session. Thank you.
[Operator Instructions] The first question is from the line of Jinesh Joshi from Prabhudas Lilladher.
Yes. Two questions. Sir first, can you help us? What is the convenience revenue and number of tickets booked in FY '21?
The tickets booked in the year 2021 were around 1,740 lakhs tickets has been booked. It is almost 50% of the tickets that we had booked in the previous year.
And what is the convenience revenue?
Convenience fee that we have realized in the year 2021 was around INR 299 crores.
Okay, madam. And secondly, if I look at our 4Q numbers with respect to the Tourism division, then what I see is that the EBIT loss is higher than the revenue. So is there any element of one-off here? And secondly, if I understand correctly, majority of our receivables pertains to catering. So while our catering revenues have gone down from INR 1,000 crores odd to approximately INR 220 crores in FY '21, the quantum of fall in receivables is not that high. So how should we be reading into this?
I'll answer your second question first. You said your trade receivables have gone down and rate is not in commensuration with the revenue earned. Actually, both cannot be compared because the trade receivable, which you were seeing since -- at the closure of the last year fiscal, was around INR 777 crores. This was including all the trade receivables of the previous years also. So this year, for the first time, we have -- since there was no accumulation of other arrears, so IRCTC focused on decreasing the trade receivable and realized old outstanding dues from the railways. So the reduction level will be different, although it is very hard, and we improved by 30% or so. And while the revenues of the catering have gone -- or is almost 22% of, you can say, of the previous year, so it is not in commensuration with this because both cannot be compared. Most of our trade receivables from the railways has been in the Catering segment. Majority of them -- 90% of them are from the Catering segment. Yes. But the total figure of the trade receivable also includes every segment. So both cannot be compared. This is the outstanding of the previous year. The revenue generation is affected because of the COVID and the pattern of the business and the pattern of the travel. Because in the first quarter, we didn't have any train. And we show -- for the first time we showed a loss. In the second quarter, we had few trains introduced. Third quarter number of trains further improved. Fourth quarter, initially, the train number reduced, then they were increased. Because April was very bad, April and May. April and May, though, were bad, but until March we could get more train.
Okay, madam. And the tourism part, if you can answer.
More than the railway.
I could not follow the...
The EBIT loss is higher than the revenue reported.
Because of the prepaid traffic, which we used to have earlier. If we see the Catering segment, our earlier sales from the prepaid segment used to be around INR 500 crores, which is not there now. And since you are asking about the tourism. In tourism, many segments like Maharaja, State Teertha, they never moved. And this air ticketing also fall. Then various train operations could not happen. All our railways tourism was put to an halt -- almost halt. It is only in the January we picked up a bit.
The next question is from the line of Urmil Shah from Haitong Securities.
Madam, the first question was on the nonservice charge revenue within Internet ticketing. We've done a commendable job in -- at a time when the volume decline has been severe. So just wanted you could throw some light as regards the different subsegments of the nonservice charge revenue and outlook for FY '22 and '23.
In 2021, the total revenue from the Internet segment has been around INR 448 crores. Although this is 27% lesser compared to the previous years because of the less number of trains being operated and the number of passengers booked have reduced to half. The share of the convenience fee in this INR 448 crores has been to the tune of 66%. That is INR 299 crore. And rest of the segment is nonservice charge or nonconvenience fee like 37 -- 33-point-something percent is from that segment. Out of which, annual maintenance of different schemes and annual other integration charges amounts to around INR 100 crores. And other businesses like loyalty cards, et cetera, was there. So INR 66 crores (sic) [ 66% ] is the contribution of convenience fee. Rest is the other businesses in the Internet Ticketing segment. The promotional schemes and the other schemes could not take up well because advertising agency was seeing a very dull sale. And not many advertisers were ready to go through the Google DFP tool also where the rate were made highly reasonable, very competitive. Rest of the revenue, like annual maintenance, et cetera, some leverage was also given to our licensees, to our service providers and partners. Because, in 2 months, they could not do any booking, so those consumer existed also. This has impacted the overall contribution in that segment also.
Sure. Madam, specifically, if you could help with the income from our own payment gateway and on agriculture advertisement income for this year.
You mean to say iPay, right?
Yes, iPay. Yes, ma'am.
So the iPay income has been -- contribution has been around 7%. Yes. It is like -- I'll give you the right figure. Give me 1 minute.
Yes, ma'am.
It is around INR 15 crores this year we have received from iPay.
As compared last year INR 28 crores which is...
Last year, we have received around INR 28 crores.
Sure, sure. And ma'am, the same number for advertisement for this year?
Advertising revenue has -- from SMS it has been very less. It is -- I think put together, it is around INR 9.78 crores, advertising revenue. That is inclusive of all, banner, SMS advertisement, government advertisement, nongovernment advertisement, put together all.
Sure, sure, sure. Ma'am, I just wanted an understanding on the margin profile of iPay. So there would be a combination of MG plus revenue share. If we look at FY '22 and '23 where there would be a normalization as regards the volume on our network, what would be the kind of revenue share that will have to be done with the partner?
Actually, the revenue sharing along with the partner, transaction -- we should understand the business in totality. First is that in the UPI, there is no show. UPI payments happening through iPay does not have any show. And when debit cards -- few debit cards have and any payment below INR 2,000 also does not have show. So after that, whatever is left, there is a sharing of around 40-50 -- 40-60 for the iPay between us and the party, our partner. So you can say the commission received from iPay -- it includes the transaction charges from the customer and the commission from the bank. Commission and sharing, we share with our partner the interchange commission that we show. We share with the bank also. First, bank takes. After deducting the bank amount, whatever is left, it is shared 50-50 between 2 of us.
Sure, sure. And ma'am, what would be the share of UPI transaction because I believe this year the proportion of non-AC volume would have been higher? So how is the share of UPI move?
24%. 24.18%. The total ticket being booked through our website through UPI handle is 24%. Debit card is around 22%. So more than 40% is gone without transaction charges show. The rest, we earn revenue on the net banking, credit cards, AutoPay. Bharat QR also has some money like that.
Sure. Ma'am, I was asking the UPI share in the number of tickets booked overall.
It is around 420.78 lakhs. Out of this 1,700 tickets, 24% I said.
24%. Okay.
Yes.
Yes. Sure. Ma'am, last question was now that the catering was allowed during the Q4, e-catering I'm referring to, and we had talked about we're looking at tie-ups with the aggregators. If you could comment on how has the traction been on e-catering? And how was your talk with the aggregators going on for onboarding it to our platform?
Are you specifically asking about e-catering or you were asking in general about the catering, Urmilji?
Ma'am, I'm asking about e-catering only.
Right. So in the case of e-catering, we have made certain changes in our policy in the aggregator model also. Fortunately, in the e-catering, we have also -- we have done a few new tie-ups, and we have increased our commission from 12% to 15% marginally. So there is going to be some benefit. And bookings are -- booking through e-catering is going up. Very recently, we have opened booking of e-catering food through our B2B partners also, ixigo, MMT and MobiKwik and the 2 other -- I think, 3, 4 other lead partners of B2C business have offered e-catering for us. So this has given some increase. And when initially we started, we were booking around 1,000 meals, et cetera. Gradually, from 1,000 meals, now on the holiday, we have reached up to 12,000 or 11,000 meals also. Although the number of our tickets being booked is almost 50% that we were booking earlier, so the -- I can say that we are about to reach the pre-COVID level very soon if this trend goes on because more and more B2C partners are going. So we are finding some light in the e-catering.
The next question is from the line of Rahul Jain from Dolat Capital.
Ma'am, firstly, if you could tell us in terms of what is the status of number of trains operational at the end of March and what is the status today? And similarly, on the number of food units that are operational at the end of March and as of today approximation?
See, I can -- you had asked about the number of trains, and what was your second question?
Number of food units and pantry cars.
Food unit and pantry car. So pre-COVID, we had 417 pantry cars operational. Now we have around more than, I think, 250 pantry cars are operating. But this number is very dynamic because the trains being announced -- these are special trains and it is of a very lesser frequent, 2 months, 3 months. The number of trains are changing very fast also. So the number I may be telling you now may not be there tomorrow.
Yes, understand. And this 250 is as of June or this is -- you are saying of March?
This is as of -- as on date.
Okay. And this 250 number...
Up to March I don't have figure rightly available at once.
Okay. And overall train basis, number of changes.
Even if there is not -- the pantry car is not there, we still have a train side vending and we still have a train side vending contracts on these trains. So those -- no train is leaving -- being left alone without a contract. Each train is a revenue for us.
Right. So the total number of trains, which were operational in March and versus now?
Plus/minus 10%, 20%.
Yes. Plus you can say it has increased by 20%. We're above the -- yes, from the March. Because recently, 800 trains -- more trains were announced. And gradually, we are getting trains in a phased manner. Initially, we got 130 trains. Then we got 140 trains. It is being increased every month, every -- rather every week.
Yes. So 800 is the recent most status, and this is 20% higher than March status?
Yes.
Okay. And in the catering business, wherever we are coming up for renewal, what are the like-for-like revenue we are collecting? Let's assume there is a renewal for Chennai station, so what was the license fee, on an average, they were paying pre-COVID versus what is the percent today?
See, many -- COVID has not ended fully. Footfall at the station has not gone up by the -- at pre-COVID levels also. So the trains -- only the reserved segment travel is permitted other than the suburban traffic. So many of the stations are not having adequate footfall. So food plaza and, say, a few units are being operated at a reduced license fee. Incremental increase in the license fee -- that happens normally annually, will happen after I think 2, 3 months when the footfall is restored to normalcy .Because when the units were closed by the state, the dies-non period starts. And in the dies-non period, you have to hold hand of licensee, so that he is able to fulfill the obligation -- contractual obligation. Just to provide services to the customers, they were persuaded to open all the units at a reduced license fee. Now today, that period is ending today. Today, we are going to decide how much license fee they will be working because the footfall in the -- at the station has not reverted back to pre-COVID levels yet. And the total number of passenger, though, in the reserved segment is more, but unreserved -- because at station, sale through food units is happening through the unreserved segment also. That is not there. So desired footfall is not there for them. So we have to work with them on a reduced license fee. Increment will happen once the normalization is restored.
Right. And on the tourism side, are losses even on a quarter-to-quarter basis -- what I mean to say, Q3 '21 versus what it is today, it has increased from INR 11 crore to INR 42 crore. So is it because we started the Tejas operation and also the Golden Chariot, which was started during this quarter? Is it some onetime expenses we have incurred towards Golden Chariot marketing or refurbishment or for Tejas, which has resulted in INR 30 crore higher losses on a Q-o-Q basis?
INR 28 crores of Tejas...
Oh, that is because of the provisioning needs. See, during COVID period, the Tejas and Mahakal operations were canceled like other trains. But unfortunately, somehow the -- we have been asked to -- the provisioning was made for fixed charges. Like some fixed charges are to be paid for the operation of the Tejas and Mahakal because we have taken these rails on lease from railways. There are fixed charges for that. But since the operation was not happening, we have represented to Ministry of Railways for waiver of these charges, which is under consideration. Because dies-non period as is applicable for the normal licensee is applicable for IRCTC as well. So we have represented -- we were given some relief initially, but that relief was not in commensuration with the total amount charged. So we have represented again to railways. So we have made a provisioning for that. Maybe once we get the approval, this will be counted in the revenue in the next quarter.
Right. So out of this INR 44 crore losses, what is this provisioning? And is it for the full year instead of 1 quarter...
INR 28 crores is the provisioning, sir.
Okay. And this is for more than 3 months, which we have done in this quarter?
Actually, for the entire year.
Okay. So basically, in the earlier period, we were not assuming this as a cost and that we have accounted in this time?
It was entering as a cost. But when we started Tejas in the first 6 months in '19/'20, we have already built in and we had paid to the railways also. And that was in our expenditure. But unfortunately, in 2021, in the beginning of '21, Tejas had to be canceled. So that is why you can see it very categorically that the trains were not being operated, which is there in our bookmarks also. That provisioning for INR 28 crores has been made this year, the document that we have submitted to stock exchange.
So basically, this INR 28 crore amounts to the leasing charges for period of January till March...
Leasing charges and the fixed haulage charge.
Okay. This is only amounting for 1 quarter only?
No, sir. It is for the entire year.
For non-operating.
For nonoperating years, for which we were told to pay by Ministry of Railways.
Okay. This was the total quantum for the full year?
Yes.
Earlier the fixed lease charges and haulage charges were not expensed during the quarter, and that's why all of them have accumulated to INR 28 crores, which is charged in this quarter?
Yes.
And any significant spend we have done on this Golden Chariot during the quarter because...
Golden Chariot, most of the marketing was done by local offices. It's only the digital marketing we did. No paper advertisement, nothing needed. We have not resorted to any press releases, other than Bharat Darshan where we had a very petty -- we have done a very petty expenditure. In fact, we had -- our total expenditure on the marketing would not have crossed even INR 1 crore.
Right. So now just to...
We spent mostly on digital media. We highly spend on print media.
Right. Just to get the understanding. So in this quarter, when we report the April, May, June quarter, the losses in this period should more be on line for what we saw in Q3 because this onetime INR 28 crore thing will not be there. So it will be reduced by this amount in the subsequent quarter.
Yes. It may be reduced in the first quarter or second quarter this year if we get approval -- from the moment we get approval from Ministry of Railways, for which we are working very hard. We have also presented, but I would say is very -- in a very coordinated manner and they appear to be very much convinced. So let's see when we get the letter.
The next question is from the line of Urmil Shah from Haitong Securities.
Ma'am, not sure whether it is the right time to discuss on this, but just wanted the thoughts on the train privatization program. Last quarter, we had said that the process is getting delayed. So one, an update on the same. And is there any update on our plan for a JV or leasing out option?
See, the date of commission of RFP has been extended from 30th of June to 23rd of July, first is this. Secondly, IRCTC had -- was very much in the race. I told you that we -- I told earlier -- in the earlier conferences also that IRCTC has been qualified for almost 11 clusters except for the Bangalore cluster -- 10 clusters because Hyderabad we did not apply. Our stand remains the same. We are in process of getting our partner. There's slight change in our strategy because now we are looking for a strategic partner who can go ahead with us for more than other trains -- for all kind of -- all such kind of operations happening in the future. So expression of that -- expression of interest for that is already out. And the date for closure of that RFP is going to be around -- is around 2 July. 2 July we are closing that. And we are also in talk with many rolling stock providers and other financial houses so that we can find a partner who can spend some money. As you can see that there is some change in our segmental revenue also. So we have to find out a partner first to go ahead in this tender so that we can participate in more clusters.
Sure. Ma'am, did I understand it correct that you are looking at a partner who can participate in this league of privatization and also on other operations like the Tejas trains, et cetera?
It is a strategic tie-up. It is a strategic tie-up where we are looking a partnership person for who can send some equity in the company. Though we have results, but we can't spend it all. Otherwise, our development will come to a halt. So we need to have a person -- we shall be forming a SPV or JV subsequently. Right now, SPV is on the cards.
Sure, sure. Ma'am, just last thing was on the ticketing business. Has that seen a pick up to be talked of? Or we'll have to wait for one -- things to normalize and our volume also to augment, which might happen during the year?
See, if you see the previous year, 2021, the number of tickets booked have reduced to half. In April, it further reduced for few days because many trains were canceled. May picked up a bit. But in June, there has been a very good increase. On few days, we were looking around close to 10x tickets in a day. So I can say the trend is very positive. With the more trains being introduced and the 2S class being there, the Internet booking in June has been much, much better than the previous year. Of course, previous year, we had COVID. And the previous June also.
Sure. Ma'am, my question was more on the bus ticketing business, bus ticketing.
Bus ticketing. Sorry. I'm sorry. I considered that as a railway ticketing. Bus ticketing has started picking up. Initially, there were hiccups with the lockdown happening because this is being driven by many state governments. It has started picking up. But it is -- the pace is very slow. I must say pace is very slow. We are now planning on marketing along with our partners.
The next question is from the line of Richard D’souza from State Bank of India Mutual Fund.
Just a couple of questions from my side. I just want to know that currently you said that about 800 trains are operational somewhere in June. So pre-COVID, what was the peak number of trains operational?
See, the -- I said the train -- 800 number of trains were ordered. That they will be operating. If I give you the current figure, in the month of March, we had a total 430 contracts for the train for the catering. And now we have around 450 trains contract available and the 100 such contracts are in the pipeline. So these are the catering contracts. But our revenue from trains is not only the catering revenue, it is the ticketing revenue also. So where the trains do not have pantry cars also, so that if you multiply it by 2, so you can say around 950 or 1,000 trains might -- would be running. I'll give you the exact number before I close.
Yes, yes. I just wanted the number of trains...
Before I close I'll give you the exact number.
Yes, ma'am. I just wanted the number of trains which are operational for which ticketing is being done.
Okay. I'll get you the number.
Let's say, pre-COVID peak and currently now in March, March and June. So that was one number if you could share. And the second thing is when we move the reservations basically from unreserved to reserved, that S2 category, so how many coaches were added or how much incremental tickets could be on offer?
I will give you the coaches that were added were of the 2S class, right? So in the 2S class, our booking is amounting to be -- in the year 2021, the percentage booking for this particular class has been to the tune of 36%, which is slightly lesser than sleeper class, which is the highest, around 40%. So you can say the second class is now beating and tracking with the sleeping class also. So the increment in the ticketing has been basically due to this and the number of trains.
Okay. I'll come back later, and I would appreciate if you could share the number for the trains.
Yes. Yes. Just wait for a while. I'll get you.
The next question is from the line of Varun Goenka from Nippon India Asset Management Company.
My question is around ticketing. We were doing around 30 crore, 32 crore tickets before pandemic hit us, FY '20, I believe. If you can give a sense of what is the kind of ticketing opportunity we have for the next 3, 4 years because there is a large non-PRS segment? A lot of unreserved category. So where this 30 crore, 32 crore tickets become over the few years when even normalization happens and government gives you more ticketing areas, opportunity related to managing the whole ticketing part?
Sorry to interrupt, Mr. Goenka. There is a slight disturbance coming from your line. Request you to mute your line while the management answers your question.
Sure.
Well, I would like to explain first that it is not only that the reserve ticketing that we are doing, we are assisting Indian Railways in the nonreserved segment also. Because the payment gateway in the nonreserved segment are being provided by IRCTC only. But it is kind of a social service where we are not getting any revenue. So it may not be of much importance to you. But whether we have been trying to get some share in the nonreserved segment also in the form of a convenience fee. But the amount of ticket value is very, very low. So in order to promote the digital payment, Ministry of Railways has taken a call that service charges will not be there. It is only the bank charges that bank might be charging at their end. At many places, bank may not be charging because the transaction is happening when these tickets are very low. So as of now, what I foresee that this 2S -- getting us a percentage of the 36% will be the determining factor in the years to come. So in the next 2 years, this 36% figure will vary up to 40%, may go up to 40%. That is my personal thinking. And sleeper class also will go up because you would have seen that there is increase in the total traffic. Earlier, we were booking around 72% of the Indian Railways ticket. This year, we have booked around 80% of the railways ticket, reserved segment. So this 8% increase in the overall ticketing -- don't go by the number overall percentage. The number of persons booked, if we see that, we see some light over here. But if we -- our effort in getting some share in the unreserved segment also succeed, then we will be a double gainer later. At least we have been trying.
Sure, ma'am. And on the payment gateway side, the efforts that we were making, if you could help us with the progress that side so that eventually all payments go to iPay itself and we have to share less with the banks.
It will not be in the interest of industry and being selfish on the part of IRCTC, if I put iPay. Firstly, it's not that iPay will not be handling this alone. Why we have such a multiple solution? We take money from many of them. Transaction charges we share with them. Of course, our share in the iPay is more as compared to the other PGs. There's no doubt about it. But we have to see that the passenger is a key and we should not get greedy too. Gradually, we are proliferating, but gradually we are increasing the lead and the forum, the place, et cetera. We are changing. And end of the day, we are a government company with 67% share of the government where we have to ensure level playing for all our partners. If I have iPay, I have Citi CG also -- sorry, I have ICICI CG also. I have Razorpay also with me. To be fair to them, they are also giving me money. So I have to take everyone along in this digital journey of India.
Right. Just a final point. Will we eventually look to integrate all air ticketing, bus ticketing, railway, foods...
They are already there. There, I can -- because these are my businesses, they we have given preference to iPay. Preferences are there. It's not that we are not giving preferences to iPay. We are -- in fact, we are going forward also in getting some licenses from RBI, so that we can take this iPay for the other government agencies for -- as a payment mode. Efforts are on. Maybe next year, you'll hear that.
The next question is from the line of [ Manan ] from ICICI Securities.
My question is towards the capital expenditure across your IT infrastructure, across railway units and private groups that we are planning to bid as and when the bidding gets started. And if any other areas I have missed. What will we our capitalized expenditure in these areas?
This year, we have spent around -- we intended to spend INR 100 crore, but because of the restriction imposed and the second wave starting in February itself and we got -- reduced ourselves to INR 73 crore. But we have ordered and this year we are planning to spend again around INR 90 crore to INR 100 crore in improving our infrastructure in Internet ticketing. Because the tenders which we could not do the previous year, we would be doing this year.
And ma'am for Rail Neer and other endeavors?
Rail Neer, we have 14 -- earlier we had 14 plant operational. Now we have Una plant has also been made operational. Bhusawal is going to be completed very soon. And Vijayawada is like -- I think Vijayawada, NTPC, Simhadri and Bhusawal shall be commissioned in this financial year. And the other 2 plants in Kota and Bhubaneswar will come up in the 2022 and '23.
This will be INR 20 cores, INR 25 crores kind of number or much less?
Less -- they are lesser. Because we have 72 plant is with the -- I think there we have given them capital support of INR 8 crores each month. So you can say 8, three we have already given the support because the machinery has been installed.
And 3 more, so 25?
'21-'22. '22-'23, yes, I think only INR 16 crores will be the support.
Okay. And ma'am, for the private routes, as and when they come in, we were planning to have the rates on our own books because it was a better IRR given 10-year depreciation. How does that work? And what are we planning there?
It certainly works very nicely provided we win a tender. And as of now, for running Tejas, we were given certain dispensation and certain handholding was done by Indian Railways. If they go for a private rate now, so one thing is getting them -- first is getting them approved from RDSO and other railway official agencies will be a challenge for us, one. Secondly CRA sanction will also be a challenge for us. Thirdly, if I use old rates and railway loses revenue, then the dispensation given to me will be withdrawn. I think I have been able to make myself very clear, sir, that we are -- as of now, we are using the coaching stock of Indian Railways. It will be a real challenge for IRCTC to run with the private stock as of now. Because if -- but if we win a private train tender, then we'll have to get separate sanction for those trains. Then there shall not be a problem. That will be a different story. This is going to be a different story. Yes, your point is well taken that running by with a private stock may be cheaper option as compared to Tejas.
So ma'am, as of now, we have no such plans and nothing budgeted for that endeavor, right?
Private train may -- what we have to spend this year is, first, to winning the tender, we have to plan the PG, et cetera. We have already provisioned around INR 60 crores, et cetera, we have reserved. Then in case we spend, then we are also looking for equity participation from our partner. 60%, 50%, he would be doing, that we would be doing. You can say we have made an internal provision of around INR 400 crore and sales wise year-by-year. In any case, if we win tender, say, by September or October or so, 2-year time period is still there to start the operations. So the planning will be done by getting the best rate because SPV will be there. They will be tendering it out. And the best rate of the rolling stock provider will be taken, then the provisioning will be made in the next financial year.
My last question, who will be these typical partners that we would have?
I cannot disclose as of now, sir.
The next question is from the line of Mayank Babla from Dalal & Broacha.
Congratulation on a good set of numbers, ma'am and sir. Ma'am, you have given us the number for FY '21 in nonconvenience. Could you give the same for the quarter, the nonconvenience income, and same number of ticket books for the quarter?
Unfortunately, for that particular quarter, I'm not having the number readily available, but can be made available. Let me see. Let me see. Okay. Convenience fee was around INR 150 crores quarter 4. Just wait for a while. Wait for a while. I'm sorry. I don't have these figures readily available with me. Give me some time. I'll get you.
Sure, ma'am. And just 1 more, if I could squeeze in. The Rail Neer capacity as of date.
Rail Neer capacity earlier -- with 14 plants, we had around 14.08 lakhs per day. With the new plants coming up this financial year, 4 plants have added, so it will be around 16 lakhs per day. But the demand -- if the COVID continues and the demand will be less, so the production level will -- may be -- not be there, the whole capacity utilization of the plant may not be of the top notch. The COVID is actually affecting our -- this business, catering and -- and you know Rail Neer is an extended catering.
Right, right. Okay, ma'am. I'll just wait for the number of tickets whenever -- in the queue for whenever you get the number.
You can note it down, sir. You can. So in the month of January, we had around 281 lakhs, in February 298 lakhs, and in March this is 319 lakhs. So you can now combine 3,257 -- around 898 lakhs, 899 lakhs something.
Sure, ma'am. I'll do the reverse calculation.
The next question is from the line of Niket Shah from Motilal Oswal Mutual Fund.
Ma'am, just 1 question. I wanted to understand what will be the peak revenues given the fact that we go back to pre-COVID levels and adding the new trains which will also come on -- come onboard. If you just take that into consideration, plus the 2S benefit, what can be the peak revenues that we can generate? Because it's very difficult to bisect and dissect in a COVID period because the trains will -- there are multiple trains starting up at a higher point and then they kind of shuts off and again starts up, so very difficult to bisect, dissect there. So would it be possible for you to give us some sense of what can be the peak revenue that one can assume, assuming everything goes back to normal?
Assuming everything goes to normal, we'll not be that -- hope everything goes to normal fast. Still that we personally feel, because we are in the hospitality sector, we are the worst affected. And tourism may not happen because till the user restrictions are there, sir. And because Maharaja...
Ma'am, I'm just trying to understand on the transactional ticket part of it, ma'am.
Only the ticketing part you said?
Yes, yes, yes.
Everything will grow the way it is growing.
No. What can be the peak revenues for that, ma'am? Or if you can just tell me how many will be the peak tickets?
Peak ticket volume. We have already achieved 80%.
No, no, no. Ma'am, my question was assuming all the trains go back to full utilization the way it was earlier in pre-COVID level, what can be the peak revenues or peak ticket sales, whichever number you want to give it, because it also -- it will include 2S, right?
Last year our total revenue from Internet Ticketing segment was around INR 619 crore, right? Out of which, 58% was from the convenience fee. So that was around INR 349 crores. So you can say if we go back to previous volumes, and then we would be around -- we would be earning around INR 360 crores to INR 400 crores from the convenience fees. And therefore -- sorry, sorry, sorry. You can say INR 349 crore was there because we started in the September '19. So you can take out the average for the month and then multiply it by that figure.
The next question is from the line of Dhruva Mukherjee from Malabar Investments.
So ma'am, has the share of bookings coming from our B2C partners gone up over time?
It has...
And how high do you see it going?
Well, if I share the exact figure with you, the bookings with our B2C partners are really doing very, very well. So I can say that -- let me -- our B2C partner bookings earlier were around 14%. Now they are around 16% -- 17% bookings were happening through our B2C partner as a normal user. There, the revenue -- we have additional revenue also.
Exactly. And do we mind it going as high as possible? I mean how do you feel about transforming from a B2C company to B2B?
Why should I stop? Tell me one reason. If I'm getting INR 1 per ticket why should I stop there?
No reason to stop. But do we want to remain the first place that a customer goes to for...
Actually, you have to be -- like we have various kind of booking pattern. We have a B2B partner. We have a e-governance team also. We have G2G partners also. Then we have a normal user booking also. So we have provided multiple channels. So it is going to be survival of the fittest. But whosoever is going to present the booking in the fastest manner and the nicest manner and give the facility to the customer, so he will drive away the business. And for me, the site is going to be mine. So I'm going to be benefited by more B2C partners as compared to B2B, but still B2B is a gainer for me because still I get the convenience fee.
Yes, yes. And currently what share of bookings would be coming from offline agents?
Offline agent now is going very less. It is around -- these are generally, I think -- offline is in -- we have only in the Internet cafe scheme. They are around to the tune of 3% only. Then you have government G2G business where you have many facilitation centers of the state government. There, the booking is not even 1%. Then you have -- in the -- most of the bookings are happening online only. Even in the government sector also, where the forces that we have tied up, they're online. Offline, we don't do. But railways that do is around 20%. Still, they're doing 20% because 80% is online.
Okay. Okay. So people are getting agent ID on IRCTC and booking as a...
Yes, yes. From 72%, the journey has been up to 80%. Maybe next time when we talk, we have traveled further.
The next question is from the line of Ashish Aggarwal from Principal India.
Yes. My questions have been answered.
Can I answer the question that how many trains are running as of now on Indian Railway? So it is around 1,500 trains are running. I think -- hello? Many of you had asked. I think Urmil had asked and after Urmil from Dolat Capital had asked. Someone had asked how many trains are running from the Indian Railway setup where the bookings are happening? There are around 1,500 mail express train. And suburban services are also there, passenger trains are also there, but they are in the unreserved segment. That is happening mainly in the Western region.
Due to the time constraint, this was the last question for today. I would now like to hand the conference over to IRCTC management for closing comments.
Thank you very much, all of you. It has been a really brainstorming session. The year has been very difficult. And initially, we were not doing very well in the first quarter because IRCTC had so loss in the first quarter. But gradually, we improved in the second quarter. Then third quarter we improved further. And in the last quarter, we improved further. And put together, I think we have been able to bestow your confidence of our investors and declared a dividend of around 50%, INR 5, at the face value of INR 10. And this is after the pandemic also. The pandemic is still continuing. As I've been mentioning every time, that hospitality sector has been worst affected and the tourism is going to take some time to take off, especially the inbound tourism because many of the air traffic restrictions are still not open. So our queue traffic will take some time to cope up with the changing environment. Secondly, the catering pattern is also changing. The segmental profit pattern is also changing. The pandemic has affected each and every corner of our eating habit also. The market, though, will decide who lives in this market for long, but we hope that these things will change. And by saying so, I wish you all the best, everyone, for the coming year and stay safe. Stay healthy. May the COVID not take over you, and you should all stay healthy as well. Thank you very much, investors. Thank you very much once again. A very good afternoon.