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Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to H.G. Infra Engineering Limited Q4 and FY '22 Earnings Conference Call. [Operator Instructions] Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Rishav Das from Pareto Capital. Thank you and over to you, sir.
Good morning, everyone. This is Rishav Das from Pareto Capital. We represent Investor Relations for H.G. Infra Engineering Limited. On behalf of HG Infra, I welcome you all to our Q4 and FY '22 earnings conference call. I have with me from the management Mr. Harendra Singh, Chairman and Managing Director; Mr. Rajeev Mishra, CFO; Mr. Vinod Giri, Operations Head; and Mr. Sanjay Bafna, Group Finance and Accounts Head. We will have brief opening remarks from the management followed by the Q&A session. Please note that certain statements made during this call may be forward-looking in nature. Such forward-looking statements are subject to certain risks and uncertainties that could cause our actual results or projections to differ materially from these statements. H.G. Infra will not be in any way responsible for any action taking place on such statements and undertakes no obligation to publicly update these forward-looking statements to reflect subsequent events or circumstances. I would now hand over the call to Harendra-ji for his opening remarks. Over to you, sir.
Thank you, Rishav. Good morning, everyone. Thank you for joining us on this call and hope all of you and your families are keeping healthy. I am immensely proud of the performance that our company delivered for the year gone by. In FY '22 we reported stand-alone revenue growth of 43% to reach INR 3,615 crores surpassing our target of INR 3,400 crores as guided during the year. This reinforced our belief in continuously delivering sustainable growth. We surpassed our EBITDA target as well reporting INR 585 crores with 16.2% margins, which remained as guided despite inflationary pressures during the year. We faced several headwinds during the year especially in the last quarter with rising price of key raw materials and various input cost pressures on account of disruption due to COVID, higher crude prices and geopolitical tension, et cetera. However, our strategy on selective bidding and constant efforts on operational efficiencies coupled with multiple digital initiatives helped us mitigate this pressure and continue maintaining our profit profile -- margin profile. Our total order inflow in terms of EPC value stood at INR 4.328 crores for the last financial year. The total order intake for the year is slightly lower given the intense bidding competition, which saw major bidding coming in from private players during the year. However, we continue to remain confident of the future inflow given the robust bid pipeline and on the back of the strong tailwinds with the government's focus on infrastructure spending. Let me now give you some color on the sector. The second wave of COVID-19 and sooner monsoon in the country have impacted on the execution of certain projects. The execution was lower across industry due to the unseasonal rains and cyclones combined with a steep rise in the input prices limiting the ability to ramp up significantly. The total construction of national highways was 10,400 kilometers, a decline of nearly 24% as compared to the previous year. However, the NHI and different agencies outbid last year's performance, the government initiative to construct 25,000 kilometers of national highway in FY '23 give us a lot of visibility on tendering activity going ahead. Further, the government's overall plan to develop 2 lakh kilometers of national highway network by 2025 helps us remain confident in the opportunities the sector has to offer. Moving to the operational performance of the company. We have achieved major milestones in several of our projects, which have driven growth in the financial year. We were pleased to receive the PCOD of 3 of our HAM projects: Gurgaon Sohna, Rewari Ateli Mandi and Narnaul Bypass. We also received PCOD for our EPC projects, including Banar-Bopalgarh and Jodhpur-Marwar throughout the state of Rajasthan and Morshi-Chandur Bazar of Maharashtra. I'm pleased to announce that we are eligible to bonus in Rewari Ateli Mandi and Narnaul Bypass project for 170 and 255 days, respectively. I would like to give a small brief to the forum on the progress we have made in our major EPC projects. We have made significant progress on Delhi Vadodara Pkg-4 project, which has almost completed now and further we have applied for COD of the same. In DV Pkg-8, we have made good progress and have completed around 75% till date. In Delhi Vadodara Pkg-9, we have completed around 59% till 31st of March. In Hapur Morradabad EPC project, we have completed close to 78% of the project and we expect to complete the project in first half of FY '23. However, we applied for the PCOD of this particular project likely to be achieved in June '22. In the Mancherial project of Adani, we have completed around 56%. There has been some land discussion into that. But however, again we are applying for the PCOD of this particular project in June '22 so likely to get by July. In the EPC project which we received on 28th of October of Karala-Kanjhawala in Delhi that is a UER-2, we have completed 4% of the work. The progress of this work has been very much disrupted because of the initial construction ban for the [ NGT ] reasons and later on in the month of January, the reason behind has been the adverse weather of rains and fog and winter. However, now this project is going on well on track. In our latest EPC addition Neelmangala-Tumkur, we have received letter of acceptance in January '22 and are yet to sign the concession agreement, which is likely to be signed in June. Coming to our HAM projects under execution and newly added HAM projects during the year, which are also progressing well as per the scheduled timelines. In Rewari Bypass HAM project, we have completed around 60%. In Raipur Visakhapatnam AP-1 HAM, we have received -- recently achieved the financial clearance and received the appointed date at 31st March 2022. In Khammam Devarapalle Pkg-1 & 2, we received letter of acceptance in the month of September for which we have signed the agreement for Pkg-2 on 25th of February 2022 and expect to sign the agreement for Pkg-1 in month of June. Lastly, in 2 of the HAM projects of Raipur Visakhapatnam corridor, that is in Odisha Pkg-5 & 6, we have received letter of acceptance in the month of October and signed concession agreement on December 14, 2021. Further, we have received the financial clearance from the bank on March 25, 2022 and May 6, 2022 and we are likely to get the appointed date of these projects within a week, 10 days' time. For all the 9 HAM projects, we have a total liquidity requirement of INR 1,137 crores that is projected till FY '25. Of this total amount, we have already invested in INR 354 crores as of March 2022 and we project to invest some INR 459 crores during this financial year that is FY '23. Before I share the outlook and guidance with you, I would like to hand over the call to our CFO, Rajeev Mishra, to touch upon the financial highlights of the company. Over to you, Rajeev.
Thank you, sir. Good morning to all of you. Let me brief you on the financial performance for the quarter and full year ended March '22. For the quarter: stand-alone revenue stood at INR 1,026 crores, we reported an EBITDA of INR 157 crores and PAT stood at INR 91 crores with a margin of 8.9%. For the full year performance: revenue stood at INR 3,615 crores, a growth of 43% as compared to last year; EBITDA stood at INR 585 crores with a margin of 16.2% and PAT stood at INR 338 crores with a margin of 9.3%. Our endeavors to strengthen our balance sheet continue to remain our focus. Total stand-alone gross debt as on 31st March '22 stood at INR 315 crores. This includes working capital debt of INR 44 crores, term loans plus current maturities of INR 271 crores and NCD of INR 97 crores. Cash and bank balance on stand-alone level stood at INR 159 crores. Our consolidated debt stood at INR 1,183 crores, which includes project loans of INR 869 crores. Cash and bank balance on the consol level stood at INR 165 crores. We have seen further improvement in our working capital also. As on March '22 we had debtors of 49 days, inventory days were 36 and creditors days were 54. Overall, net working capital of 31 days compared to 33 days at the start of the year. Our debt to equity position has also improved during the year with a further reduction to 0.23x as of March '22 in comparison to 0.28x at the end March '21. We are also proud to announce and share with all of you that we have been awarded a rating upgrade by ICRA from A+ to AA- on long-term facilities and from A1 to A1+ on the short-term facilities. With this, I will now request Harendra sir to take the things ahead for the further remarks.
Thank you, Rajeev. Let me shortly touch upon the digital initiatives we have undertaken during the year. We rely strongly on having accurate and timely information, which helps us in executing and in achieving operational excellence. On this front, digital transformation continues to be a key focus area for us. We have undertaken several new technology initiatives in the company during the year and implemented various solutions to enhance our operational efficiency and cost reduction measures. Some of the initiatives we have taken are sensor-based technology for fuel dispensing and fuel level management system and that gives us the real-time information on consumption and puts effective control on fuel cost, which is a major constitute in our material. We have already enabled this technology on 40% of our moving machines. There are also other active initiatives that improve equipment control, vehicle management and inspection and offer multifunctional applications to automate our manual process and more. Finally, let me brief you on our guidance and outlook for this financial year. We have time and again demonstrated our strong execution capabilities. Our experience and demonstration on the execution front combined with the ability to operate and complete projects in a timely manner gives us the confidence of maintaining growth going ahead. We aim to achieve revenue of INR 5,000 crores while maintaining a 15.5% to 16% EBITDA margin range for the financial year FY '23. The key focus ahead will be on winning selective projects that complement our order book and ensure efficiencies. Our goal is to achieve INR 9,000 crores to INR 10,000 crores of order inflow in FY '23. We already have numerous bids underway yet to open for a total of INR 14,000 crores in road projects, which are under both EPC and HAM. We are very confident of receiving good order inflow in FY '23. We are optimistic and believe that the infrastructure sector has a lot of runway yet to cover. The long-term visibility of awarding activity and government spending rightly positions us to tap into various opportunities coming in our way. Given our comfortable order book position, strong revenue visibility and healthy financial position; we strive to keep improving efficiencies and further enhance our position as a leading infrastructure developer going ahead. Now I would like the moderator to open the floor for question and answer. Thank you.
[Operator Instructions] The first question is from the line of Mohit Kumar from DAM Capital.
And congratulations on a good set of numbers especially for the fiscal year. Sir, my first question is on the guidance. What kind of guidance for revenue and EBITDA margin you expect in FY '23 and given that there's a muted order inflow, how do you see FY '24?
So already guided during my speech that we would be maintaining an EBITDA margin of 15.5% to 16% during FY '23 and an order inflow of about INR 9,000 crores to INR 10,000 crores during the year. And whatever you are saying for FY '24, I think with the likely order addition of INR 9,000 crores to INR 10,000 crores during the year and with the stable commodity price hit, we can just imagine that we would be again maintaining that 16% to 16.5% EBITDA during FY '24.
Can you just repeat the revenue guidance? I didn't get it.
It's INR 9,000 crores to INR 10,000 crores during the year this FY '23.
That's order inflow, correct, sir?
Order inflow, yes. The revenue is already given that INR 5,000 crores of revenue to be done during the year of FY '23.
Okay. Understood, sir. Second is where are we in terms of monetizing our portfolio given that roughly around 3 to 4 projects have commissioned? And the related question is that I understand that you are eligible for bonus for all these 3 HAM projects. Can you just let us know how much bonus we can expect in FY '23?
See the bonus, which you are saying, is not for all 3 projects. It's for 2 projects only and that is almost equivalent to about INR 24 crore, which is we are likely to get within this first half of this financial year. And as far as monetization of these assets is concerned, we initially had a discussion last year, but later on we decided just to hold for this for at least 6 months or 9 months gap. First started getting the NBT and having the experience of O&M of these particular project or annual O&M maintenance. So this is where we were again reinitiating our talks with the potential investors. So most likely by this year-end, we would be in a position to get the transaction done.
The next question is from the line of Shravan Shah from Dolat Capital Markets.
Congrats on full year, very good start-up for 4 months and also good to hear that INR 5,000 crore revenue guidance that is a 39% growth so that boosts the confidence. Sir, just to touch base on the INR 9,000 crore to INR 10,000 crore order inflow that we are looking at. So can you split in terms of the EPC HAM how much we are looking at? So previously we were saying that INR 6,000 crore order in HAM we can take without going for monetization. So is that stand remains the same?
Yes. Of course I think for HAM, we are keeping a guidance of about INR 3,500 crores of addition during this FY '23 so that we would be getting at least EPC value of INR 3,000 crores into that. So out of this INR 9,000 crores, INR 10,000 crores, this is one and where we are looking for certain project of say in Ganga Expressway and we have already discussed that is a EPC project. And apart from that, we are looking into INR 1,000-odd crores of addition into other sectors, which we tried for this in FY '22 even, but we could not succeed it. But this year we are very much hopeful with our teams already equipped that water sector or railway, we are looking at about at least 10% of addition on this sector and remaining are the EPC of NHI.
Okay. And roughly in terms of the Ganga Expressway, it would be the INR 3,000 crores to INR 4,000 crores kind of EPC value. So it would be a 1 package or more than 1 package?
It is a single package, which we would be getting as a group that is not less than INR 4,000 crores, which letter of acceptance we are expecting very soon because the notice to proceed has been issued to us.
Okay. Got it. Second is in terms of the appointed date. So previously we were expecting the -- as you mentioned that in weeks or 10 days we will be getting the appointed date for the 2 packages of Raipur Visakhapatnam. What about the Khammam, when we will be getting the appointed date and the recent Karnataka EPC projects so when the appointed date is expected?
See, with the OD Pkg-5 & 6 which are likely to get within this month only. Only 3 packages would be left out where the appointed date is yet awaited. That is Khammam Devarapalle, which in any case we will be taking the appointed date in September and October of those packages. There's a significant improvement in the land availability is now visible. And then again Neelmangala Tumkar, which is the EPC project of NHI, so August or September that is again. So in quarter 3, we would be getting the appointed date for -- quarter 2 by end, we would be getting the appointed date of all these 3 projects.
Okay. Sir, the other question is in terms of the working capital. I understand in terms of the days it has improved. But if we look at it in terms of the operating cash flow so INR 363 crores odd kind of a cash flow has gone into the working capital, particularly contract assets and contract liabilities. So can you explain a little bit more so why it has happened? And can we see that trend should be changing because that would be putting a pressure on the CFO because overall CFO for this year has significantly reduced versus last year INR 527 crores last year, now INR 114 crores?
See, the total -- if you are looking to the March numbers, you can see that the total debtor which has been significantly gone up. The reason behind is last year there was a unique circular issued by NHI by 22nd of March -- 22nd date of March, they have insisted that the bill should be passed and paid during that year. So for that reason, we got most of the receivables of NHI EPC in those years in a timely way means in the March itself. So that gives -- so there's a substantial reduction in that and resulting in the cash available at the company. But then again this year, if you can see, out of the total debtors of about INR 277 crores in these projects of government, NHI, Ministry and NDBC. We received INR 194 crores during the month of April only. So it's not a long-term receivable or a stress receivable. They are all on track. So that is a significant number, which you can see at the year-end of FY '21 and this year. But most likely as we already have guided in the Q3 con call that this debtor is likely to reduce because the SPV debtor, which has not gone very high, it is all in control. So there has been some inbuilt revenue in SPVs because we have recently completed all 3 and certain [ COSb ] are likely to be received. So there it is there. But otherwise we have seen that there is not much of an increase in the debtor even if we have increased 43% of our revenue so the debtors is not increased and we would be in a range of about INR 450-odd crores of debtor receivables on a yearly manner or quarterly basis.
Okay. Got it. And lastly, on the data point, sir. So equity requirement you said INR 459 crores to be invested in FY '23. So what about the balance out of -- to be invested in '24-'25, what would be the CapEx? Because last time we guided INR 75 crores in every year and returns on money, mobilization advance and unbilled revenue number as on March?
So if you first have the equity -- balance equity requirement. The balance equity requirement for FY '24 is come in about INR 208 crores and followed by FY '25, it is INR 113 crores. And the second question has been...
CapEx? So last time you said INR 75 crores kind of a CapEx. So the number remains this?
Last year it has been the same, but this year we still expect that there will be a likely increase that CapEx would be not in the INR 175 crores bracket because with the orders which we are expecting and these are the substantially significantly good magnitude of orders. So we expect that the orders -- the CapEx addition would be in the range of INR 110 crores to INR 120 crores. That is a net CapEx addition because we are in that range where with about in 2016, '17 we started our major CapEx addition and within that 5 to 7 years, our fleet need to be young as we always believe for a better operational efficiency. So we would be just phasing out those CapEx to sell out those CapEx. So net CapEx requirement is coming at about INR 110 crores to INR 120 crores.
Okay. Lastly, the data point on retention money, mobilization advance and unbilled revenue as on March?
So mobilization advance has been decreased by almost INR 65 crores if you compare with March '21 numbers. Unbilled revenue that has been -- has given the reason for it. In SPVs we are -- most of the contract assets are there where the all final bills and [ COSb ] and everything is now on card. But again we have decreased the unbilled portion, but there in NTPC we are doing some potash transportation works merged with the Adani project of Mancherial where slight INR 61 crore is there. But altogether, this unbilled is in Delhi Vadodara packages or UER that has been in the range of about INR 77-odd crores into those projects. So not all unbilled, it is all we are getting on a quarterly manner.
Sir, is it possible to summarize everything in terms of the absolute number. So last time we said retention money was INR 182 odd crores as on December, mobilization was INR 271 crores and unbilled was INR 340 crores. So what would be the corresponding number for -- as on March?
No, no. What you are looking at INR 520 crores is the debtor.
Sir, I'm asking retention money as on March, mobilization advance as on March and unbilled revenue as on March.
Retention money is about INR 180 crores, INR 361 crores is the unbilled revenue and what else?
Mobilization advance?
Mobilization advance is INR 195 crores.
The next question is from the line of Ashish Shah from Centrum Broking.
So the first question is that there seems to be a little bit change in the accounting where a part of the other income has gone and been reported in revenue. So if you can just explain the change which has happened in terms of accounting.
So there is the other income, which was coming from other parts like rental revenue so those have been now taken into main revenue. So it's not a big number. It's almost INR 7 crores which is there.
Right. So it's the rental income which we have taken as a part of the reported revenue.
Earlier it was -- so you can see the number change from '21 to '22. So this is the only number which has changed.
Right. Sure, sir. Secondly, in terms of the revenue if you try to reconcile it from the individual orders, it seems there is some change of scope, et cetera because the difference of the order backlog is not really adding up to the total revenue that we have reported. So if you can just highlight if there has been any significant change of scope or order addition in any of the projects.
No. Change of scope in the tune of over INR 95 crores has been recognized during the quarter 4. But otherwise if you can see, the total of INR 7,972 crores of order balance is there.
Okay. Sir, was there any utility shifting revenue which was sizable for the quarter?
Yes, of course. I think it is an ongoing process in any of the COSb or utility shifting. So a significant revenue, if you can just -- it's not that a big number. But definitely if you see the order balance, it is about say INR 120 crores for utility and recently almost it's INR 95 crores on the COSb, which has recently been recognized.
Okay. For the quarter, it would have been how much, sir, for fourth quarter?
Sorry, for the fourth quarter, what is the revenue portion?
Revenue on the utility shifting part?
It's not that big number. It is only INR 14-odd crores. The order balance which we are talking for.
Right. No, that I got, sir. That part is okay. Lastly, on the financial closure side, are we seeing any tightening in the market in terms of some of the smaller players or some of the unlisted players who had got big amount of projects last year? Are we seeing any difficulties in financial closure for those projects? And as a result of that, is it possible that we could see a significant amount of slowdown in bidding from such players in this financial year?
No, we cannot rule it out. Not a significant trend is visible as far as financial closure, but definitely banks have taken a caution to fund those companies where they take significant portion where the equity is not enough. But you cannot just say as a trend which we would be expecting within 6 months or say quarter 2 to 3, we would be in a position to just witness those improvements as the competitive intensity is concerned.
Right. And sir, just last one if I may. The INR 5,000 crore guidance that we have given for '24 -- '23, that seems to be a little steep. If you can just probably break it up into how much of this INR 5,000 crore you expect will come from the projects where you are still expecting the appointed dates? Because just intuitively, sir, this INR 5,000 crore number seems to be a bit too steep given the order backlog position. So if you can just break it up, it will be helpful.
So what we have considered out of INR 7,900 crores, which is the order balance. So out of this, the projects which are under execution which appointed date has already been declared, so those orders -- those executions from those projects would be in the tune of INR 3,200 crores. So that gives the visibility that for balance INR 1,800 crores, we are expecting some INR 800-odd crores to be executed in Ganga Expressway and INR 1,000 crores would be executed in these appointed date which in quarter 2 we are expecting. Because significantly mobilization has already been done into these projects so these are almost about INR 2,200 crores project where the appointed date is we would -- we are expecting in quarter 2. And then this Raipur-Visakhapatnam I have already considered in INR 3,200 crores.
The next question is from the line of Vibhor Singhal from PhillipCapital.
And congrats on a great execution once again. Sir, just to harp a bit more on Ashish's last question of INR 5,000 crore guidance. Sir, you mentioned INR 3,200 crores is what you are expecting from the under execution projects. This includes the 2 Vizag HAM projects?
Yes. This is all inclusive, which I'm talking about Raipur-Vishakapatinam corridor, all 3 projects where appointed date on 31st March received for AP1 and OD-5, OD-6 inclusive of that.
Got it, sir. So now if I look at our order book, let's say total order book of around INR 8,000 crores and out of that, almost INR 4,000 crores is already under execution and around INR 2,000 crores is the Raipur-Vizag 2 packages so almost INR 6,000 crores of order book. So you are expecting INR 3,200 crores of execution from almost INR 6,000 crore of orders. So almost 50% of the projects of this entire under execution order book will be completed next year?
So let me correct you. You cannot just compare based upon that 50% of the total execution is going to be done within the year. So this is you can say that Delhi Vadodara Pkg-8 & 9 where about INR 600 crore something is balance, which we expect that 100% by October we are completing those projects. So with that, I think it's those projects like Hapur Morradabad of IRB. I already indicated that in June we are likely to get the COD so not much of a balance is there. If you are talking about Adani project from Mancherial that we are likely to get COD in July or August and the balance was execution of about there is a significant portion where the land portion was hindered. So by June -- by December '22, we are likely to complete. So those are all the projects where we would be completing these projects and where the balance is. Only the project which could be spilled over in the next year FY '23-'24. So that is I'm talking of UER that is a Delhi project and if you talk of Odisha Pkg-5 & 6 and the AP-1. So those are the projects which could be spilled over. The balance all will be completed during the financial year.
Got it, sir. And in terms of the Ganga Expressway, as you mentioned that we have already received the notice to proceed. So basically I just want to -- I think when do you think we would be able to start execution on this because I think we are already at the end of Q1, Q2 will probably be impacted by monsoon. So do we expect that to start somewhere in Q3 or maybe before that as well?
No. In Q2 we can see not much, but at least INR 50 crores to INR 100 crores of execution because the appointed date is likely to be got because in north the monsoon is not that prolonged. So by August time we would be in a range, we would be likely to get the appointed date.
And sir, we would be able to start work only once the [ Ravi ] group gets the financial closure, right? And they get the financial closure approval from [ UPA PID ]?
Well, there are 2 ways. One is the client aspect of condition to finance is the EC and all and their financial closure. I think so this 3 months' time is a reasonably good time for them to complete each and every condition required.
Got it. sir. And sir, just last question from my side on the margins front. I know in this quarter also we reported very strong margins despite inflationary pressure on the commodity prices. How do you see it playing out over the next year? I know you've given a guidance of 15.5% to 16%. But do you think that in the next 2 quarters, especially Q1 and Q2, the cost pressure could actually be much higher and we could probably see some more correction in the margins and then probably recover in the second half or do you think we have enough buffer and enough, let's say, provisions in the system to be able to maintain a steady kind of a margin through the year?
So we have seen the margin pressure in Q4, that is all visible. But in Q1 again, we cannot rule it out because the projects which we are now in the main stream of execution, those are all projects were being awarded to us 2, 2.5 years earlier. So there I think you can just speak to the commodity hit where this margin pressure is there. But later on I think significant execution would be coming from those projects which we got during March '21 or so. So those are the projects where almost the prices which we have considered in our rates, they are not that -- there is not big gap into recent price of commodity to that. So we will not see much of a hit in quarter 2 and onwards quarter 3 and quarter 4. So quarter 3 and 4, again we will be in a range of about 16% to 16.5%. So that is I'm giving an average of about 15.5% to 6% -- 16%, sorry.
Got it. And sir, last question if I may. Any non-road orders that you are looking in this year in terms of either water or irrigation or just even any of those orders that we are planning to bid for and probably included in our INR 9,000 crores to INR 10,000 crores of order inflow guidance?
Yes, sure. We are looking at about say almost 10% or INR 1,000 crores to INR 1,500 crores of order to be added especially from water sector like JJL where we already had prepared, but because of UP elections we could not bid that [indiscernible] and all. But now we are targeting the 3 states are there with JJL projects, which we would be looking for. And other than that, railways always has been -- we are continuing for bids of those projects. We believe that INR 1,000 crore to INR 1,500 crore is expected during the year and that is our gut feeling that we would be getting it.
[Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of Jiten Rushi from Axis Capital.
Sir, my first question is on the Adani UP project. Sir, can you just highlight in detail for the project like what would be your mobilization advances, public application bonus, execution timeline and sourcing of aggregates for the project whether it will be provided by Adani or we should be doing through mining our own? So a bit broader view on the project that would help us to understand.
See, this project is almost a group of 151 kilometers and for that, one is the lump-sum turnkey EPC project to us. It's at similar terms and conditions with NHI except for the price variation conditions where we also experienced a big hit in our EPC projects rather than the HAM projects in our last few quarters. So we have just gone into arrangement where the price variation clauses having the star rate price variation rather than any of that where the moving average or any of the WPI or CPI has been referred to. So there has been a significant change in the condition as far as the PV is concerned.
And other than that, all conditions are the same that we need to design, construct each and everything, 27 months is the duration. So if we complete in 24 months, we would be getting some INR 50 crores of bonus into that. That is a maximum limit of 3 months and INR 50 crores. And the aggregate which we are looking at, we are deploying few of our [ mines ] to source the aggregate and so catering about say 30%, 35% of the total aggregate requirement. Balance we are going to outsource because this is in UP, we are going to get aggregates from about 200 kilometers to 250-odd kilometers lead.
Sir, you said that on the price variation, it is based on the actual billing you'll get repaid what I understand, right, sir?
Star rate, basically it is a star rate price variation for us.
And this aggregate you said 30%, 35% you will source from your own mines and balance you will purchase from outside which is 200 kilometers, 250 kilometers from the site, right?
Correct.
So the margin from this project could be in the range of what 15%, 16% or even higher?
Yes. Even we expect that 15% is not ruled out because the PV is not going to impact in any case there.
So sir, we are targeting to complete this project well before time because as you said, you are being targeting around INR 800 crores from this project. So what would be your target for FY '24 from this project in terms of revenue?
With the tentative appointed date likely to receive in August with that 27 month comes in '24 December tentatively. So we are looking at about a 24-month completion timeline for this.
Basically in December you can see or in FY '24 we can see INR 2,000 crores plus of revenue almost, INR 2,500 crores.
For sure.
Sir, coming to this only so what could be our revenue guidance for FY '24 then?
See, with the likely order inflow during the year about INR 9,000 crores to INR 10,000 crores and with the current order in hand, we believe that we would be executing some INR 5,000 crores during the year. And with that, we are looking at about INR 6,000 crores, that is about 20% year-on-year for the next year '24.
Sir, with this mammoth growth which you are guiding, any impact you will see on the working capital because now your share from subcontracting will go up significantly in revenue. And the payment terms obviously I understand could be good only. But we have seen in the past where private players have a payment issue, there are delays where we are seeing IRB or Tata projects or even Reliance. So how are you going to manage your working capital in such case?
So the conditions with Adani is very specific that they are going to give us the mobilization advance as well as each and every term which NHI usually is having in their EPC and it's a monthly payment. It already has -- they also -- it's a big project for them. So in any case for any reason is prolonging the execution for payment is not likely to happen for any of concessioner or a developer. So it is like once they have declared that INR 50 crore bonus is there for 3 months so they are going to reduce the interest during construction and just to start the toll even. So we do expect that I think whatever stress we have experienced in -- but for Adani Mancherial project, we have never experienced it. Today even there's a monthly payment cycle in which we are getting, every month the payment is being received.
So you will get the 10% mobilization advance here also so there should not be any issue in terms of execution.
As you can see that we are balancing out the total orders into the HAM as well as our EPC and EPC private even. So there the balancing is still visible that the payments though bit of a stress in IRB and then the Rajasthan project. But then again we are able to manage that having a decent working capital cycle.
Sir, any more subcontracting projects are we looking for now or we are okay with the Adani project?
Say by this June, we would be completing this IRB project and it was significantly about 22% or 23% of the total orders last year, which were from the private players. So with that, it would definitely for a shorter period of time of about 6 to 8 months, it would be visible that the private players contribution into the total orders is at 40%. But later on it would be even 35%. But later on it would be all decreased. We are not looking ahead for any further addition of this scope.
And sir, the NCD which we have reached so what is the rate at which we are and what is the payment terms?
It's a monthly payment. The broken -- monthly payment. This is a breakup of it, within 10 days of our commission of bill, we would be getting 50% of the payment and balance within a month.
No, I'm asking about the NCL of INR 97 crores, which we have raised. What is interest rate and door-to door payment terms?
It is 8% flat and the payment term is 18 months of the moratorium, which repayment will be started in June '23 and to be paid in 18 months -- subsequent 18 months in a quarterly manner.
Sorry, sir. To be paid -- I cannot -- can you repeat, sir?
Six installments every quarter that would be repaid.
Okay. Starting from June '23. So basically Q1 '24 and then 6 installments quarterly.
Yes.
The next question is from the line of Prem Khurana from Anand Rathi.
Congratulation on a pretty decent set of numbers during the quarter. Most of my questions are already answered. So just 2, I mean more on sector. So one having essentially Ministry of Road Transportation and Highways recently came out with a notification wherein they seem to have changed the bidding criteria for hybrid annuities. And they're moving from bid price to bid project cost and O&M would be fixed as a percentage of the bid project cost that you gave. So how do you see this to kind of come to impact competitive intensity that you see for hybrid annuities? I mean do you get to have the feeling that because of this now because there's limited scope for you to be able to get an upfront O&M, you would see bids to turn C&I and therefore, competition would go down and we would tend to benefit.
I think what you're saying, this is -- they are, say, almost streamlining the disparity into O&M, where I think upfront loading or say forward loading was there. So we cannot -- we don't see any big challenge as far as there is increase in the competitive intensity or the people would be taking, because it is a very nominal number. If you see any of the projects, which we have [ bidded ] and we are doing. There are the -- reasonable O&M has been there. So we are doing those O&M and -- with the same cost. So it doesn't make sense. That's why [indiscernible] they have indicated that 0.6% say year-on-year or initial years of 0.4%. [indiscernible] crores of say, [ CPC, centennial project cost ]. It is coming at around INR 2 crore to INR 5 crore in the initial year, later on increased to INR 6 crores. Then I think first overlay being done, with that overlay, I think, again, being reduced to INR 4 crores. So it is almost the same, but they are now regularizing our standardization that say, one cannot interpret and just indicate [indiscernible] is possible.
No, sir, I was asking whether you see any change in competitive intensity because of this, because some of the small contractors were kind of quoting a little low in terms of O&M and were able to kind of make it a success now essentially because I think given the NHAI, I was kind of hesitant to give these orders because they felt, I mean, there could be a situation wherein if you were not to quote the right number in terms of O&M, you could have a situation wherein the contractors doesn't kind of honor the O&M commitment and lease the asset in between. So do you see any change in competition or no?
No, no, nothing will be changed. It is basically standardizing the O&M. One cannot just bid INR 1 crore, if it is required for say INR 5 crore or INR 7 crores. Yes.
Sure. Sure. And sir, I think this -- the excise cut, which is there, I mean there is this fear in the market that because it is coming from road and infrastructure SEZ, which is where I mean people are slightly worried whether NHAI would get to have money in time from the government to kind of meet their obligations or the commitments. So I mean, any conversation that you would have had with either [indiscernible] to NHAI?
I think it's the all industry representation coming to the government, which is not only highway, it is all builders, et cetera. So this cut or, say, any of the relief given in the prices of diesel even. So this is all because they are seeing that the commodity price is going very high, inflation is at an all-time high. So it's not that result that we would be getting that the budget would be impacted for that reason and the infrastructure further, say, for '23 or '25 the range in that subsequent years, it would be reflected. We do not see that is some indicative in that.
Sure. And just one last, if I may, please. So for the orders, I mean we're still waiting for appointed, it's possible to share how much is the mobilization advances that you would be able to kind of draw? How much more is possible from these orders that you already have available with you?
You can say that the orderings the mobilization advance, which was at about INR 323 crores at the year end of March '21, now is reduced to INR 210 odd crores. So with that, I think the appoint date of Raipur Vishakhapatnam, all corridors and say, in quarter 2, 3. The view could be, again, coming back to about, say, INR 350 crores to INR 400 crores of mob advance received -- being received from SPVs or from these clients.
Sure. And just one last -- sorry, on I mean given the fact that we've attained PCOD for 3 of our assets now, any efforts on refinancing, anything that you could share with us, please?
We've already done our assignment and whatever the interest rate, which we are getting from NHAI or the annuity payments, we have -- cost incurred by us is much less than what [indiscernible] we are getting right now.
Sure. Possible to share the number, sir, I mean, the revised number in terms of finance costs now?
It's almost about 7.1% to 7.3%.
[Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of Dhruv Bhimrajka from Monarch AIF.
Congratulations on a good set of numbers. Sir, for the equity requirement of INR 459 crores as a figure for FY '23. So are we confident of doing it all internal approvals? Or are we planning the source of spending for this amount?
No, no. It has to be done from the internal approvals only. We don't require any of the sales -- debt or any equity to be raised for that reason.
Okay. Okay. And sir, one thing, which I noticed in the presentation versus the 3Q '22 PPT is that for OD-5 and OD-6, the land acquisition numbers in the previous presentation were approximately 90%. And in this PPT, it is 88% and 81%. So is there a mistake or has something happened…
I think there has been some mistake into that. Earlier, we have considered the forest, forest whereas I think some notification was just to be issued. The Stage 1 clearance was done. But Stage 2 would not conclude at that time. So it is because of that. Now it is a phase, right number is 88% where joint memorandum has already been signed with NHAI, that's why we are getting the appointed date within a week's time.
Okay. And sir, just one last small question is that for the Rewari Bypass Stage 4, in the previous PPT, you had mentioned 37% physical progress completion, and it is the same number in 4Q '22. So any reason for not much execution on this one quarter-on-quarter?
No, I think I've already told that 60% of the execution that has been done in March -- by March 2022.
The next question is from the line of Vishal Periwal from IDBI Capital.
Sir, I mean, from a repetition point of view, you mentioned INR 5,000 crore breakup revenue, one is like INR 3,200 crores from the current projects, which are under execution. You mentioned something for Ganga Expressway and for AD, which are appointed, can you just repeat that?
Yes. So what you -- want me to repeat?
Yes, sir.
So if you consider this Raipur Vishakhapatnam, all 3 packages, which within this month, we are going to get upon the date, 1 and 2 more will be received. There's INR 3,200 crores would be executed from this, out of -- most of the projects are say about 6 projects are there, which are nearing completion and would be completed by Q3. So they all would be contributing majorly into those executions. And apart of them, from INR 800 crores from Ganga Expressway, which we are going to start, say, by August end. And the remaining Khammam-Devarapalle Package 1 and 2 and the Tumkar Karnataka package of EPC NHAI. So there, we are expecting some INR 1,000 odd crore would be executed in those projects.
Okay. No. Just to repeat. So you mentioned INR 3,200 crores from the project, which are under execution, where, I mean, like AD and everything received and INR 1,800 crores Ganga Expressway. So?
It's not INR 1,800 crores, it's INR 800 crores.
INR 800 crores, okay, my mistake, right. And so will that be fair to say since Ganga Expressway and the project AD, which are yet to receive probably they will happen sometime in September. So second half, we'll see a pretty strong set of growth vis-a-vis the first half on Y-on-Y basis?
Yes, of course, I think you can very well assume that, the second half would be -- really, there's the robust growth would be visible there.
Okay. And then you did mention like for Ganga Expressway notice to proceed is received. So is that like an order inflow is just around the corner within this quarter can be receive it for Ganga Expressway?
Yes, we are expecting by this month end.
This month end. Okay, right. And one broad industry question. Between EPC and HAM, which is a better model from a developer point of view to get our cost inflation on raw materials?
See what we have experienced for us, HAM is a decent one where we doesn't -- felt, the big impact was there. But in EPC, we have seen that impact is because of the -- some formula correction is desired at the contract level. So what -- we already initiated our request to NHAI and Ministry, they are doing so to get it corrected because earlier it was all standard formula for all EPCs, having a different complexity of the commodity component. So now they are going to complete it. But in any case, probably later on, I think it would be EPC or HAM irrespective, it's the same. It would be the same.
Okay. So will that be fair to say for HAM projects, what was the cost simulation that we get? It's maybe like some bit of division in a monthly, quarterly basis, but it's the complete pass through?
No, no. It's not a complete pass-through, but we have experienced there is not a big impact because most of the HAM, which we did, it's not in quarter 3 and quarter 4, not [ shipping ] number has been executed in these quarters. So we have completed mostly in quarter 2 or 3 some portion in quarter 3. So with that, I think we couldn't get, say, we didn't have that big impact into it.
Okay. But I mean, yes, it's commendable like at least on a numbers basis, the number -- I mean, on the margin basis, the numbers are still being maintained, 15% and 16% here.
The next question is from the line of Amber Singhania from Nippon Mutual Funds. Mr. Singhania, you audio is very low. I would request you to increase the volume on your phone or speak louder.
Am I audible?
Better.
Sir, just wanted to understand a bit more on the revenue guidance, which you have shared, I know you have explained a lot. But just to clarify, you are saying that INR 1,800 crores roughly is the order book of the old orders, barring the new ones as -- so entire INR 1,800 crores will get executed out of Raipur and Karala, which is INR 2,000 crores, you are expecting around INR 1,000 crores, Raipur Visakhapatnam 1 and Karala, which has just started. You're expecting INR 1,000 crores out of INR 2,000 crores of order book, balance INR 4,200 crores, where you are expecting AD, you are expecting another INR 1,000 crores. And the INR 9,000 crores kind of revenue or order inflow, you're expecting around INR 1,200 crores. Am I correct, sir, on that line?
No, probably I'll just correct it that the project, which where the appointed date is already received. It's not INR 1,800 crores. It is coming at about [ INR 50,000 ] Crores.
Yes, that includes Karala and Raipur Visakhapatnam 1, right?
Yes. Then if you include that, it is [ INR 3,800 crores ] rather. So what I'm saying is, out of those projects, out of those projects, we would be completing almost INR 3,200 crores, but that includes the packages of OD-5 and 6, where we are going to get the appointed date within a shorter period means within a maximum [indiscernible]. So that gives that indication that about INR 2,200 crores of orders -- the order where we were likely to get the appointed date within a week time, they are all being added into it.
So INR 6,000 crores of orders will give you INR 3,800 crores of revenue this year?
INR 6,000 crores of the total order balance, we would be doing some INR 3,200 crores out of these projects.
Sir, but considering out of this INR 2,200 crores, you are still awaiting AD, so second half will be under execution. Isn't it a very aggressive estimate to...
See for any of the projects, which we have already, say, almost in March '21, they were awarded. And where they are, we are already significant mobilization being done, most of the things are aligned, designed, et cetera. So as soon as we are getting the appointed date and the land is all available. So it's a -- we would ramp up the execution to that extent, that is quite visible, quite possible even.
The next question is from the line of Franklin Moraes from Equentis Wealth Advisory.
So I wanted to just understand in terms of the EBITDA decline of maybe about 1 percentage point on a Y-o-Y basis, what could be the probably contribution from input prices? And what could be the contribution from rising competitive intensity?
No. I think there is no driving competitive -- competitive intensity, which has impacted our margins because these all are the projects which we say, they're all being awarded to us from 2.5 years back. So it's only price hit, which has impacted the margin.
Okay. And the newer or other rate changes that the government has introduced on exports, which is likely to push down the domestic prices in iron ore and steel, what is the kind of benefit that can happen for our projects?
Definitely, the problem which we are -- it is so severe. We would be, say, getting some relief out of it. It's not that we will be benefited, but the margins impact, which has been so significant in quarter 4, which likely to subside -- get subsided during -- not in quarter 1, but in quarter 2 at least.
The next question is from the line of Amruta Deherkar from Wealth Managers.
Congratulations on the performance. I have just 2 questions. First one being, you talked about the EPC formula correction for the cost inflation. So is it safe to assume that whenever this new formula has been implemented by NHAI, so we will be getting the impacted facts later on?
No, no, see, the formula would be for our new EPC bidder. It will not be having any impact for the older one.
So what would have been the impact on the FY '22 EBITDA? So if you could give us a quantification of roughly how much could have been the impact?
I have just given the indication, then quarter 1 or maximum quarter 2, the things would be all stabilized, we would be coming back to the normal of 16% to 16.5% EBITDA.
All right. And my second question is regarding the HAM projects, which you've received the provisional completion certificate. So when will be -- from when will be the annuity be payable, like will be receivable for us? And if you could give us the amount of the annuity that was receivable?
See, the annuity amount is just 2% of the total project cost. And this is every 6 months, we would be getting the annuity. We have already applied for the annuity, and which is likely to be, say, in the system, say, within a week, but this annuity payment, doesn't matter [indiscernible]. So there's only SPV or [ throw-up ] mechanism where the annuity payment would be received in those.
So on a standalone basis, the annuity payments should have no impact?
Yes, nothing.
The next question is from the line of [ Vikas from Health Services ].
One of the small [indiscernible] required, is it recently the company has acquired in the 26% in the safety first engineering and safety first partnership, which is around INR 9 crore investment is there. Any rationale behind for such kind of the small investment?
It's very specific commodity, which is being used with a significant miscellaneous item. There's a metal beam crash barrier or such kind of a crash barriers. We usually are purchasing from out of the market. This is a dedicated where we have invested. And there is a lot of opportunity going ahead, where I think most of the companies, they have done a [indiscernible] say internally. So this is not being done only, but it is a significant portion being taken into as a stake in that company.
We have the substantial cost saving in the future?
Yes, of course. I think that's why the decision has been taken.
Okay. So right now, we have hold, it is 26% in private limited and partnerships, correct no?
Correct. Correct.
The next question is from the line of Alok Deora from Motilal Oswal.
So just -- so most of the questions were answered. Just a couple of questions. Sir, you mentioned about the increase in the CapEx for FY '23 as compared to the usual run rate. So is it like for next few years the CapEx will continue to remain in this elevated range of INR 100 crores to INR 125 crores?
No, no. It's not like that. This is -- we are looking at a significant increase in the order inflow, given that particular year. So for that reason, we have indicated. And then again, as in 2016, '17. So this is almost 4, 5 years, 6-plus years of CapEx being put to use. So this is the older fleet now being with the latest technology, so that would be added benefit in our operational efficiency, fuel economy is there. So all technical benefits are available and then definitely getting the right value of the depreciated product. So this makes sense that [Audio Gap] Just INR 70 crores, INR 75 crores, where it will be in a range of about say, for this year, it is at about INR 110 crore to INR 120 crore, but then again, it would be stable to say about INR 100-odd crores, INR 90 crore to INR 100 crores.
Sure, sir. And also, sir, at the very start of the call, you mentioned about FX monetization by end of the year. So any discussions are on? And just wanted to understand what's the appetite currently in the market, if you could just throw some light on that?
Appetite in the market is all available. It was only a matter of debate on the O&M cost, which we are just looking at it on a practical basis and what they are assuming on a projection basis. So that is the only gap, I think. And with all say, reads -- say all data being started off, had it be rate of interest, had it be GST impact on the annuity, now the things are very clear. So there's not a big debate is going to be done. This is only the -- their keenness is there, and we believe that within a few months, significant improvement in that basis would be -- and that mode would be done. And by this year-end, we are looking for the projection to happen.
So we are not looking at any sort of delays in that, right? I mean that's the -- by that time, we will be through with some -- this transaction on the monetization part.
No, no, no. We don't believe there is a -- we are expecting much delay.
The next question is from the line of [ Deep Sirwani ] an individual investor.
Sir, congratulations on the good set of numbers, especially given the rising input costs and the inflationary environment. I had a couple of accounting questions. So first is building on the contract assets and contract liabilities question that was previously asked. So is it fair to expect that eventually these contract assets and contract liabilities, given our work as we deliver, we should expect them to turn into cash for the business. And second, there has been a substantial increase in the non-current financial asset side. I was just trying to understand what exactly goes into these. And similarly, there has been increase in the finance cost that we have paid, although as you mentioned that the payment terms for NCDs are yet to start. So again, what exactly went into this increased finance cost? Yes. These are the only questions.
So as you have -- I think the first question is about contract liabilities and contract asset. The contract liabilities are, again, the mobilization advance, which we usually receive in all the projects, had it be from the HAM projects and through SPV or these are the other projects, EPC or any other private client. So this is a -- during course of execution, this mobilization advance would be recovered. So -- but then again, we are almost interest-bearing. It's not that they are free of say, interest. Number 2. So the contract assets are those assets, which is a part of unbilled revenue. So we are doing those on EPC mode. So there are a few of the milestones or stage payments, which usually could not be converted. And mostly, we experienced those things to happen in the projects. We have a significant execution post 75% plus execution on that execution has been done. So there again, those unbilled portion remain as the contract liabilities, I would say, [indiscernible] contract asset, which is a part of us. U.S. is there, there's certain body variation, certain modification is there into the contract, certain milestones are there, so all in settling the final bill. So there, we have seen that there is every month, I would say, every quarter, there is a significant portion being received and significant portion being added into it.
Okay. All right. And the second question was around the increase in non-current financial assets and the finance cost.
Can you just give the number of this non-current financial asset? So can we -- do you see GST receivables from government authorities?
Okay. Yes, I was just having a look at the consolidated cash flow statement. The overall increase in the non-current financial assets that we see is around INR 4,000 crores something -- INR 474 crores approximately, and the finance cost has gone up by 23%, around INR 118 crores.
Consolidated you might have seen, that's annuity, I think. That is annuity.
Okay. Okay. Okay. All right. And on the finance cost side?
No, no, finance cost just doesn't have an impact in the parent company. It is all SPV, where the entire financial model has been taken into consideration.
The next question is from the line of Faisal Hawa from H.G. Hawa and Co.
Sir, going forward, the competition is continuously rising in the tendering. And most people are quoting even below the bid price. So this will lead to real destroying of many companies. So how are we really preventing from that happening? And with the large U.S., they got Adani also coming in, how will we really protect ourselves from really bidding too low and going wrong?
See, we are maintaining our own standards and discipline for the biddings, at least maintaining and keeping a balance. So that is only what we can say that we are keeping a say, quite a good control on, say, what should be the margin, wherever we are moving as far as geographical areas where we can, it is a right move for the company. Had it be a balancing order of HAM and then EPC and then say, private EPC even. So that is how I think we are keeping control on those things. And I cannot say much about the most of the company is doing wrong and just losing because of that reason. So that is all evident, I think.
Because we have seen a new player like Adani coming in and bidding so many contracts, all through the country. And this means that there is hardly any entry barrier into the road construction vertical.
This is -- they have opened the competition for the player for at least for the asset development. It's not only for EPC. For the developer, they have opened it for all the core sector experienced players. It can be a board, it can be any building or it can be any real estate. They cannot just bid for those who have our EPC project. So sorry, BOT project. So they are now going, as a developer, they are doing those things. But for the EPC, they're, say, getting it done through the players like us only.
So would it make sense now to go into more BOT projects because there the competition is much lesser and very few players where you know the government has made the laws and the rules quite easy and favorable to the developer?
The things as where the traffic origination and destination CapEx studies are here. They are all kind of projections. We cannot assume a right estimate, you can just stick onto the right estimate what exactly would be the traffic, say, going into your project which we have developed. So ultimately the things are -- say, most of the things are, now dynamics are changing. The year-on-year, you're seeing that lot of NHAI and national highway, expressways, and these the corridors being developed. So this estimation at this point of stage is I think it's not appropriate.
And do you feel that irrespective of whether you know NHAI get these SEZ fund or even if the minister is changed or whatever the kind of momentum that NHAI has now gained will really continue over the next 4 to 5 or 6 years?
Probably, we have -- they have already indicated and the government has -- it's not their work, there is not ministry, which is indicated. The government has indicated that Bharatmala 1 to be awarded in next 2-years. With Bharatmala 2 to be approved from, say, this parliament. So there, I think they've been on developing at the core network for national highways and expressways. Hadn't been [indiscernible] which they have rolled out. So this means that infrastructure development in all sectors to be taken as a control in umbrella. That is -- these are significant sincerity of the government, let's say for those infrastructure development projects.
So on a very ballpark figure in the next 2 to 3 years, how much would be the total ordering that could come through or what is the total addressable market that we have for the next 3 years?
For us?
Yes, yes, I mean for overall the industry?
So I'm not having a big idea on it. But definitely, in most of the sectors that can be water sectors, [ AVM ], or railway, they have the high speed density...
Sir, only in roads.
I'm -- roads definitely it's say they are already having that totally 1,000 kilometers to be developed in Bharatmala 1 and 2. So this is the good sense that within next 5 years, a lot of opportunities are likely to come.
So in amount of crores what would that mean, approximately?
I'm not having a fair idea of it.
The next question is from the line of Shravan Shah from Dolat Capital Markets.
Yes, sir. 2 questions. First is, we said that we have bidded for projects of around INR 14,000 odd crores is it right and if you can break it into the HAM EPC.
I have seen that, I think it is a, some mistake, which I have conveyed that is INR 14,000 crores -- INR 1,400 crore. Where we have -- there's the only 2 projects with the, say, we are yet -- the bid results are yet omitted. Because they're not -- say much of activities, say bidding has happened in last April and May.
Okay. So this is -- these 2 projects are EPC projects?
These are EPC projects, correct.
Okay. And lastly, on the date front, so given everything strong guidance. So the date are likely to be maintained at the current level of 300 to 350 that's the level that we will look for at least 2 years?
Correct. Correct. Correct.
The next question is from the line of Meet Parikh from Anand Rathi.
I just had 2 questions. First question is on the receivables front, how much is the receivable from Adani and IRB? If you can tell us, sir.
Adani receivables are including retention, it is coming at about INR 52 crore and IRB receivables are about say it, including retention, if you -- if you take out the retention, which is not yet due, it's not due with INR 167 crore.
INR 167 crore. Okay, sir. And on the second question, sir, when you had given guidance for the EBITDA margin of 15.5% to 16%, in FY '23. Does it include the early completion bonuses from the projects for the HAM projects we are going to get or not?
No, no, it is not even -- not considering it.
The next question is from the line of Jiten Rushi from Axis Capital.
My question is on the HAM side, so government has recently proposed for the net worth criteria, change in network criteria. So what is the status on that, so you might -- the large case I was discussing with the government [indiscernible] So when is this expected to get implemented? Because that is very important because most of the smaller players net worth are in the negative trajectory, and still we are able win projects. How do you see this to get normalized or being on yet? The proposal will not get passed [indiscernible].
So there are few more modifications already been, say, given. So that's why the bidding activity is now almost at a standstill. So they are going to do this modification very soon.
So what kind of modification are these? Can you throw some light?
One is the network criteria, one already is the O&M criteria with they have standard as a percentage basis of the BPC on the percentage base of EPC.
EPC. And sir, Rajasthan malls and Maharashtra malls, so these projects are in a standstill or we can see some execution from these projects?
No, no. We have already executed some INR 60 odd crore during the year in the Rajasthan projects. So it would be all at a snail's pace. It is not like that -- there's a great chunk of the revenue is expected in '23 even. Maharashtra even it's bits and pieces, things are being moved. We are doing some execution, but not more INR 22 crore of execution being done last year.
On the exit of the senior management of Mr. Vinod Kumar Agrawal. So any replacement are we looking out for, or we are going to continue with the same team?
Sorry.
Vinod Kumar…
Sir, on the Vinod Kumar Agrawal sir's exit, are we looking for any replacement in the senior…
No, he was looking into the indirect exit, and we have already, say, engaged one more senior position for that.
Okay. Sir, last question is the ordering mines, are we looking for any mines in Telangana and AP region because now we have a significant order backlog from this region. And we are expecting some sponsor execution, so seeing off aggregates from outside third-party would make sense or we are looking for…
I think they are -- all the projects do have a unique say, areas where they have been there. So those are mines in nearby, say if you're talking of even Bangalore and the Total project, or if you are Khammam Devarapalle or Orissa, all these 3 corridors, so Raipur Visakhapatnam corridor project. So where we have established most of the pressures or they have been given to the crusher which being established in our mines, our mines, which we have let's say, [indiscernible] for that specific project. So it won't be [indiscernible] usefully which doesn't make sense to establishment, because there are lot of areas or lot of the mines already established and whereas we are getting supply intermittently if there is no hurdle into it as they're getting the good rates even.
The next question is from the line of Harshad Gadekar from GEPL Capital. Due to no response, we'll move to the next question, which is from the line of Dhruv Bhimrajka from Monarch AIF.
Yes. Sir, in the latest NHAI circular, they have extended this relief measures for contractors and developers till 31st October, 2022. So how do you see this continuation benefiting you and the industry as well?
For sure, I think it is the entire industry being benefited because of that relaxation being given. And they also deferred or say extended this timeline for submission over the performance guarantee. It is now would be 3% only till March '23 as they are not going to increase. With that I think everybody is benefited.
As there are no further questions from the participants, I now hand the conference over to Mr. Harendra Singh for closing comments.
So thank you everyone for your participation in our quarter 4 FY '22 earnings call. In case of further queries, you may get in touch with Pareto Capital or feel free to get in touch with us. We look forward to interacting with you in next quarter. Thank you.
Thank you on behalf of H.G. Infra Engineering Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us. And you may now disconnect your lines.