Siemens Energy AG

XETRA:ENR

Q3-2025 Earnings Call

[Operator]

Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. Welcome to Siemens Energy AG's Third Quarter for Fiscal '25. Welcome to our conference call. [Operator Instructions] And this call will be recorded. [Operator Instructions]

I'd now like to hand over to the moderator, Tim Proll-Gerwe.

[Tim Proll-Gerwe, executive]

[Interpreted] Good morning, and welcome to today's conference call for the third quarter at Siemens Energy.

We published our financial figures at 7:00 this morning, and we'd like to give you an overview of that right now.

We are in Berlin. In addition to Christian Bruch, we have the CFO, Maria Ferraro. They are both here to answer your questions at the end of the presentation. Mr. Bruch will be speaking in German and Ms. Ferraro in her mother tongue, English.

We have 2 webcasts in, an original line and an English line where interpreters will be interpreting from German to English.

For questions, journalists who were able to register ahead of time with a separate telephone number, we sent you the link with the invitation to today's call. And of course, you can still register today now by dialing in. [Operator Instructions]

And we've seen that there are a number of investors who have already asked questions, and the investor call will be after this call. This call is for journalists only. [Operator Instructions]

The presentations can be downloaded on our website after the call, and you will also have additional slides with additional financial figures.

Please remember that there is no text on the website. Both speakers will be speaking freely. Of course, there is the recording.

I'd like to remind you of our safe harbor statement and our forward-looking statements, which are on the second page of our quarterly presentation.

Right. Mr. Bruch. You might think it's finally a boring quarter, but then you replaced the counter-guarantees and then the share price went up to over EUR 100. So we're not all that boring after all. Over to you now.

[Christian Bruch, executive]

[Interpreted] Yes. Thank you very much, Tim, and good morning to all of you. Thank you for joining us today. As usual, I'm going to give you an overview of our developments in the past quarter. And then after that overview, Maria will then go into the details of the figures.

And basically, I can only repeat what I already said in the second quarter. So yes, it may be boring. Despite the geopolitical challenges, we continued to operate in what is an attractive market environment. The rising electricity demand and the need to replace aging infrastructure are indeed ensuring a sustained high demand for our solutions.

But I will come back to the situation in the United States and especially the current tariff agreement between U.S. and EU, I'll do that in a moment. And I will also say a few words about our capacity expansions and our investments a little later.

Now, the third quarter was the most successful quarter in Siemens Energy's 5-year history in terms of order intake. Our customers placed orders for products and services worth EUR 16.6 billion, which exceeded the order intake for the same quarter of the last year by almost 65%, adjusted for currency and portfolio effects. And all segments contributed to this very good order intake. But I want to highlight, in particular, Siemens Gamesa's 2 major offshore orders in the Polish Baltic Sea worth a total of over EUR 3 billion.

I'd like to take this opportunity here to thank more than 100,000 colleagues who work very hard every day to serve our customers.

Our order backlog is now at a new high of EUR 136 billion, which is all the more remarkable if you bear in mind that we had to put up with negative currency effects of about EUR 4 billion due to the current strength of the euro. So this order backlog gives us planning certainty. That's important for us, always important, because the order situation can fluctuate from quarter to quarter.

So ultimately, it is about sustainable. It's about profitable growth. And we are currently investing heavily in this and we're developing our workforce. And as I said, in a moment, I am going to give you an overview.

On a comparable basis with the same quarter last year, we increased revenue by 13.5% to EUR 9.7 billion in Q3. The profit margin before special items was 5.1%. And the bottom line for the third quarter was a profit after taxes of EUR 697 million.

So we are on track to meet our revised forecast. We are currently aiming to reach the upper end of the target range.

Now this, our focus remains on profitable growth. We're focusing on 3 things: we need to create the conditions for growth, we want to continuously improve profitability and strengthen our portfolio. We're making discernible progress in this regard step by step.

We resumed sales activities for the revised 4.X turbine in September 2024. And in wind, we now have also started sales activities for the revised 5.X turbine. This turbine has undergone a fundamental technical overhaul and we're now starting sales with an initially limited number of units. So you can expect that it will take some time before the projects based on this turbine become visible in our order intake, and really, that is the usual sequence of project development in the wind business.

So, with that strong growth, the robustness of our supply chain is very important for us. This is especially true in this geopolitically volatility. In the past quarter, we signed a letter of intent with a Japanese company, TDK, for their supply of rare earth magnets. Now these magnets are particularly important for those large offshore wind turbines today. They're sourced almost exclusively from China.

In this quarter, an important step was the replacement of the federal government's counter-guarantees with an agreement with our commercial banks. I'm really proud that we were able to achieve this ahead of schedule. The German Bundestag - Budget Committee has taken a decision on the 30th of July, so now the basis has been laid for us to pay our shareholders a dividend for the current fiscal year if the AGM next year agrees.

Now Maria, in a moment, will give you some more details but I would like to take this opportunity to thank the German government for their support.

Now in the current market environment, we are continuously developing our portfolio. These are, first of all, steps to increase capacity or secure supply chains. For example, we have acquired our remaining 50% of the former joint venture, RWG. RWG is a company that exclusively performs maintenance and repairs for smaller gas turbines from Siemens Energy. The company generates sales of just over EUR 200 million, and we expect this transaction to close at the end of the year.

Now when it comes to partnerships, I'd like to once again highlight our cooperation with Rolls-Royce in small modular reactors. Now we do not expect the technology to be ready for the market until after 2030. However, we're already laying the foundations now to participate in future growth markets. Our partner, Rolls-Royce, has already been commissioned by Great British Nuclear to build 3 of those SMRs in the U.K. So we would contribute the conventional part to that, so we're also well positioned here.

The United States is the world's largest energy market. So it's -- well, for this reason I'd like to comment on developments there separately. And of course, first of all, there's the tariff situation. And I welcome that there's an agreement between the U.S. and the European Union, so that at least provides some planning certainty. The unilateral introduction of 15% tariffs is a significant step, and we would naturally prefer to avoid that.

But in the third quarter, 35% of our orders came from the U.S. And for Gas Services, this figure was even higher at about 50%. But still, you have to differentiate the view here. On the one hand, we are manufacturing locally in the U.S. But on the other hand, we also have international supply chains in the sense that we're not just importing from the EU.

So many details regarding the tariff situation still need to be clarified. So we can, at this moment, only estimate the final impact on us.

By the third quarter of the year, we had incurred custom duties of around EUR 100 million. In the fourth quarter, we would expect an additional mid-double-digit million euro amount.

Now given the current agreement between the EU and the U.S., that figure is slightly higher than assumed -- originally assumed. But these charges are primarily related to our [ rolled out ] service contracts where those charges cannot simply be passed on to customers.

Now given the good strong operating performance, we can compensate for the additional burden, but it is still a painful process. For new and existing delivery projects, we are normally in a situation where we can pass on the tariff to our customers.

So despite the tariff situation, we currently see an extremely strong market in the United States for energy solutions. So both in terms of the replacement of updated infrastructure and the enormous demand for electricity for data centers, in particular, are now driving very high demand for our products in the U.S.

Now Gas Services, for example, has secured gas turbine orders totaling 14 gigawatts in the fiscal year-to-date. 60% of those are for data centers.

Grid Technologies reserved an order in the third quarter for a high-voltage direct current transmission system for the low loss transport of large amounts of electricity and has also received several orders for transformers. So both of which are critical infrastructure products.

And in the onshore wind sector, we will have once again received orders for repowering, which is the replacement of existing older units.

Order rate take in the United States amounted to around EUR 5.8 billion in the third quarter, in other words, tripling compared to the same quarter last year.

In the current market environment, it is important to me to point out that we maintain a broad global footprint in terms of order intake. We have once again succeeded in securing important orders in various regions this quarter. Now Europe remains a key market for us. Investment in grid infrastructure is a major driver here in Europe benefiting our Grid Technologies business segment.

We currently remain -- continue to be positive about the investment activity in this segment here in Europe. For example, National Grid and ScottishPower in the U.K. want us to be their preferred supplier for those 2 major HVDC projects.

The Middle East like Saudi Arabia and United Arab Emirates also continue to be an important sales market for us.

And in the Transformation of Industry segment, we received many orders from Northern Europe, from Asia and Australia, resulting in a 23% increase in order intake compared with the same quarter last year.

So to sum this up, let me say once again, we had a strong quarter with a record order intake. We are working through our plan step by step and we're making good progress.

The tariffs are having an impact on our business, but we currently expect that this impact is manageable because at the end of the day our business is so broadly positioned that we can have spread those risks well.

And with that, you are now going to hear more detailed figures from Maria, please.

[Maria Ferraro, executive]

Thank you, Christian, and good morning, everyone. A warm welcome also from my side. Thank you for joining us. So, let's start with an overview of our financial performance for the third quarter at group level. As you see here, orders grew by 65% on a comparable basis.

There's one thing that I would like to point out, which is that due to the strong euro, we've had some headwinds from currency translation and foreign exchange effects, which in essence means we have a bigger spread than usual between nominal and comparable growth, and you'll see that here.

In terms of order growth that was spread across all business areas, also driven by Siemens Gamesa, as mentioned, where we booked 2 large offshore orders, each worth more than EUR 1.5 billion.

Book-to-bill ratio remained strong at 1.7%. This is driving our order backlog to another record high of EUR 136 billion, continuing to provide us transparency for the future and to provide a strong foundation not only for this year but also for midterm targets.

Looking at revenue. Here, we rose by 13.5% and reached EUR 9.7 billion. The growth in revenue was primarily driven by Grid Technologies, which grew by 26%; and Gas Services, which grew by 17%, again, both on a comparable basis.

Profit before special items increased quite significantly, almost 10x year-over-year to EUR 497 million. Here, all segments increased sharply, of course, and for Siemens Gamesa, it was as expected in the quarter.

Profit increase was mainly due to increased volume and corresponding fixed cost absorption effects. And of course, we continued to execute through our high-margin projects. This is driven by better pricing and a strong service contribution of 33% in the quarter.

Looking at special items this quarter. As expected, the demerger of Siemens Energy India Limited, this led to an effect of roughly positive EUR 0.5 billion and resulted in a profit of EUR 956 million for the quarter.

Just as a refresher, on June 9, Siemens Energy India Limited was successfully listed. As we've said before, our aim is to become the major shareholder in 2028. We will achieve this by swapping the 6% ownership of Siemens India Limited and purchasing the remainder from Siemens AG.

The required cash out for this will fluctuate with the relative share price developments of both and is included in our business plan for 2028. And of course, this depends on the share price of Siemens Energy India Limited in 2028 accordingly.

Our free cash flow this quarter was EUR 419 million, around EUR 300 million lower than in Q3 of prior year. Again, this is mainly due to a few things. One, we've had shifts to Q4. But also we have changes in our operating net working capital. This is driven mainly by a reduction of trade payables as well as a lower increase in contract liabilities. This is mainly in Siemens Gamesa. Overall, though, as expected, for the quarter.

Now let's take a brief look at the performance of our business areas on the next page. And again, please refer to our website for the complete breakdown by business area.

Looking at Gas Services, we had a very strong quarter, once again, benefiting, as Christian mentioned, from a very strong gas market. With EUR 6.3 billion in order intake, this is another record order backlog for Gas Services, which now stands at EUR 53 billion.

Looking at revenue, this stood at EUR 3.1 billion for Gas Services. This is just shy of a 17% increase on a comparable basis. Q3 profit before special items was EUR 406 million. This is nearly double year-over-year and has resulted in a margin of 13%. Overall, a very strong quarter for Gas Services.

Now looking at Grid Technologies, also with a very strong Q3. Orders at EUR 4.2 billion for Grid Technologies. This is up 24% year-over-year. And driven, again, as Christian mentioned, by the strong broad-based demand across business -- products, excuse me, and solutions as well as across different regions.

The order backlog for GT stood at EUR 38 billion.

Revenue grew by 26% on a comparable basis. This is a substantial growth and this was driven, again, by increase in both the products and solutions businesses within Grid Technologies.

Profit before special items was at EUR 448 million, almost double compared to last year. This resulted in a margin of 15.9%. And again, this improvement in profit was driven by strong underlying operational performance. Overall, a very strong quarter for our GT business.

Moving on to Transformation of Industry. Q3 orders at EUR 1.4 billion. This is a 23.4% increase driven by new unit orders therein with an increase of 35%.

Revenue for our Transformation of Industry grew by 5.1% comparable (sic) [ 6.1% ] . This driven by all business with our Compression business being the biggest contributor. Q3 profit before special items was at EUR 157 million, again, an increase of roughly 50% compared to prior year with a margin of 11.5%. Tier profit was driven by sustained volume growth, particularly in service.

For Siemens Gamesa in Q3, we had an extremely strong order intake with all other KPIs, as mentioned earlier, in line with expectations.

As you know, the business is still in restructuring or transformation mode, which means some variability quarter-to-quarter. For example, the first half of this fiscal year was trending positively versus prior year.

However, in Q3, for example, operational improvements were offset mainly by 2 effects: one, the tariff impact. Here, the business was impacted with a mid-double-digit euro amount. And this is mainly due to catch-up effects on contracts, and in some cases, onetime in nature.

Secondly, in Q3, we performed in Siemens Gamesa the regular annual update of the statistical models. This is utilized for the evaluation of the entire wind turbine fleet with respect to failure rates and cost assumptions, and this caused also a high double-digit million euro amount. Again, well within our expectations.

Also maybe to note our 4.X and 5.X provisions here remained basically stable.

So again, overall, a strong or as expected quarter for our businesses.

So now moving on to our net cash position. So with respect to net cash, here, you see, overall, we have a strong cash position with EUR 8.5 billion in cash and cash equivalents. Our financial debt reduced slightly to EUR 3.7 billion, of which EUR 2.2 billion is long term. Considering also pension provisions, so taking that into account, this brings us into an adjusted net cash position of EUR 4.4 billion at the end of June. Again, for comparison, just a year ago, we were at EUR 1.7 billion.

With this, we continue to have a strong balance sheet commensurate with our investment-grade profile, which is also reflected in our external ratings.

Now a perfect segue to the next slide. So here, you see during this quarter, we also had several milestones, which is building a strong financial foundation, for us. On June 5, we announced the replacement of the EUR 11 billion facility backed by the German federal government and the EUR 1 billion facility backed by Siemens AG. Now we have a new EUR 9 billion syndicated facility, which fully supports our large-scale project business and guaranteed demands for the years to come.

This achievement relieves us of a financial burden. As you recall, we did have a cost for the Bund Back facility of approximately EUR 100 million-plus in the fiscal year of 2026.

On June 9, Siemens Energy Limited, as I mentioned, in India, this was also successfully listed on the Indian Stock Exchange.

On May 26, 2025, S&P revised their outlook for us to positive from stable and affirmed the BBB- rating.

On June 17, 2025, we received an investment-grade rating of Baa2 with a positive outlook in its inaugural rating from Moody's.

And finally, last but not least, thanks to replacing our federal counter-guarantees ahead of time, we have created the foundational conditions for enabling dividend distributions to our shareholders as the dividend restriction was lifted as mentioned earlier. But again, this was just the first step.

Now with respect to the dividend, we have to complete the fiscal year as planned, so that we can, with approval of the Supervisory Board, recommend a dividend payment for the shareholders to vote on at our next Annual Shareholder Meeting in February of 2026.

Just a gentle reminder that our dividend policy is to distribute between 40% and 60% of net income attributable to shareholders.

Now moving on to our outlook. As you recall, we last upgraded our guidance in our second quarter financial disclosure. Today, we are reaffirming that guidance and we are currently trending towards the upper end of the ranges. Again, this includes the already mentioned direct impact from tariffs after mitigation measures of around EUR 100 million, stemming from global impact of tariffs, also including China and specific raw material tariffs.

Based on the recent EU-U.S. agreement of 15% tariffs effective from July, we now expect a further negative profit impact of up to a mid-double-digit million amount -- euro amount in Q4. This brings the total estimated impact on Siemens Energy to approximately EUR 150 million, as mentioned by Christian. Please note that this effect is already embedded in our guidance.

And in November, we will give you an update of our mid-term card targets with the full year results, and of course, then thereafter on our Capital Markets Day.

And with that, that concludes my portion of the presentation, and I hand back over to you, Christian. Thank you.

[Christian Bruch, executive]

[Interpreted] Thank you very much, Maria. As I said, I'm going to say something about our investments and expansions. We are growing, as you've seen in our numbers significantly and we're continuously investing in locations. We're hiring new employees this year. Our investments are almost EUR 2 billion globally. We're also investing in Germany.

It's important to me to talk about this. Things are happening here, and we at Siemens Energy are also supportive of the major Germany initiative. I think it is important that we highlight those positive developments. Yes, we want to restore public confidence in the future. We want to send a signal, encourage people to tackle the things we need to improve here in Germany.

And it is true that many of our investments were already planned before the change of government.

The important message to me is that we are investing here in Germany. As a company, we're creating new jobs. We're also confident that we can hold our own here as a location in global competition. And we're willing to change to achieve this. And since 2022, Siemens Energy has been investing nearly EUR 1 billion at its German sites and we are planning for more investments here as well. Last year alone, we created 1,300 additional jobs in Germany. And in the next fiscal year, we plan to hire another 1,500 new employees here in Germany.

We train young people, we hire them. And like many other German companies, we are doing this very single-mindedly, both the small- and medium-sized enterprises and the large corporations as well. I think, therefore, that it is right that the new federal government now has set itself the goal of seeking closer cooperation with businesses in Germany.

And the government has a responsibility to create structures so that those investments pay off, especially also in comparison to other countries because businesses will only invest in Germany if they find reliable overall conditions: an intact infrastructure, competitive production costs and well-trained personnel. So if businesses like ours can support policymakers in any way to create these conditions, we're happy to do that because we all care about Germany as a business location.

And now back to you, Tim. Thank you very much.

[Tim Proll-Gerwe, executive]

[Interpreted] Thank you very much, Christian Bruch and Maria Ferraro. You now have the possibility, journalists, to ask your questions.

A technical remark, you can ask the questions in person. [Operator Instructions]

We have a question from chat from Ed Ballard from The Wall Street Journal. Mr. Bruch, you talked about the increased demand in the United States and he wants to know if the demand for gas turbines is so great in the U.S. that it would go beyond the investments that you've already announced when you talked about the investments and the expansions there.

[Christian Bruch, executive]

[Interpreted] Right. should I answer in English or German?

[Tim Proll-Gerwe, executive]

[Interpreted] You can answer in German. It will be interpreted into English.

[Christian Bruch, executive]

[Interpreted] Okay, whatever is easier. Good, then I'll answer in German.

Well, that might be a possibility. It will depend on how stable this high demand is. And as you might know, today, we are manufacturing in the U.S. the blades, for example. And in Florida, we produce this for the global market, not just for the United States. And as you know, we have structures in the United States. We have plants in the U.S. and we can also expand capacities. We'll take a very careful look at that. As I said, that's what we're doing right now.

It's, of course, a question will this demand remain stable and at that high level, then would we invest in the United States? Right now, we are investing about $0.5 billion in plant expansions in the United States. And it has become a key market, and we want to be successful there.

[Tim Proll-Gerwe, executive]

[Interpreted] Thank you very much. The next question, Christoph Steitz from Reuters.

[Christoph Steitz]

[Interpreted] I have 3 questions. Mr. Bruch, you talked about a mid-double-digit figure for tariffs impacts. Is that the order of magnitude that you can expect every quarter? So will we have this amount every quarter? That's my first question.

The second question, what about the discussions with customers in the United States? You talked in the past about stability and the expectations on the horizon. Is this something that is reflected in your discussions with the customers?

And order backlog. You've been chasing record after record every single quarter for as long as I can remember. How high can order backlog become without losing its health because I know that this has been something that you've been paying a lot of attention to. Those are my questions for the time being.

[Christian Bruch, executive]

[Interpreted] Right. Thank you for your questions. First of all, what about the tariff impact? Where does this come from? Primarily from longer, older service contracts. And this is something, the burden and the charges will mean how long will these service contracts last and the contracts for new components or new gas turbine, new transformers then we can pass on the tariff effects there. So I assume that next year, we will have similar orders of magnitude.

But over the course of the year, this will go down because from the service contracts, of course, we will successfully come to an end and they will be replaced by new ones.

But I'd like to mention one more thing. These tariff effects, don't consider this only EU-U.S.A. The effect -- the steel tariffs have an impact. Mexico, Canada, other countries also have an impact. And this is something that is moving all the time. So I have to be a bit cautious here in mentioning any old figure. I think we have to take a very careful look at this because it's complex and changing.

Discussions with customers and new plants, especially Gas Turbines and Grid Technology, this is driven by the question, can you deliver? And this is something that we've done very successfully. We can present this very successfully. That's why we have very good order intake. And of course, we can also pass on the tariff effect.

But you shouldn't forget one thing, these effects also impact other suppliers just as they affect us. We're no different from the others. But at the end of the day, it means that the prices will go up. That's why we have to see how things develop when it comes to critical infrastructure. But our discussions with customers have been driven more by the question as to delivery times and not so much by the tariffs.

[Maria Ferraro, executive]

Thank you, Christoph, for the question regarding our order backlog, I like [ that, ] chasing records. And I think it's really important. This is something that I stress quarter-over-quarter. It's not just about the growth of the order backlog, it's absolutely about the quality of that backlog. And what we indicate quarter after quarter is not only are we growing in the backlog, but that the margin quality continues to expand and be better in the backlog.

And I think that's absolutely a function of what we call internally of selectivity. So of course, we don't just book an order to book an order. We're selective in those orders, but also secondly, because of the pricing power that, of course, we're able to have due to the market momentum.

So you're fully right. It's not just about increasing the order backlog. It's ensuring that the margin in that backlog continues to improve, and that's exactly what we're seeing.

[Tim Proll-Gerwe, executive]

[Interpreted] Next question from [indiscernible].

[Unknown Attendee]

[Interpreted] I have a couple of questions on Gas Services. First off, are the numbers always referring to Gas Services or all of your businesses that you've mentioned when you talk about the quarterly figures? And how full or how booked is your order -- is your order book for Gas Services, how many years in other words? And what is the markup you can charge in the Gas business in the U.S.?

Can you tell us what your overall assessment is of the situation of tariffs, not only generally in the U.S. but also globally? So much -- how much of that is affected by that situation? And do you also see picking up demand in other countries?

[Christian Bruch, executive]

[Interpreted] Now the first question, Ms. [indiscernible] are we posting a record also at Gas Services when it comes to orders?

[Unknown Attendee]

[Interpreted] That was the first question.

[Christian Bruch, executive]

[Interpreted] Okay. Now I have to think now, I think it was the second highest order intake per quarter. But still, it was a special -- it's a special situation currently that we're seeing here in the market. Why? Because there are many customers that are buying more than one gas turbine, so multiples.

And it's not only about data centers, you mentioned that. But about 60% of our demand is the usual business. So that will be coal to gas, oil to gas, that sort of conversion or normal electricity growth. And about 40% is new applications, so either the data centers but also applications like what do you use the power chips -- so power ships. So floating the power stations that can be used for emergency or crisis situations or take LNG electrification, that sort of thing. So this is now also what we are seeing and they are gaining importance.

The share of data centers, well, let me be very clear. The U.S. are dominating when it comes -- it's dominating when it comes to demand for data centers. 40% of our gas turbines are related to the data center business. Globally, that figure stands at about 25%. And of course, we are talking here about the large-scale data centers. So hundreds -- multiples of hundreds of megawatts, right? And then you would find that in regions of the world where electricity prices are low or plannable.

Now you would expect the United States with the hyperscalers, and what we also now see is the Middle East. Again, this happens a bit later with a lag, but I think that's the next big wave. Europe is a bit reticent about that, and I think that was the question.

When will you be fully booked as it were with your orders? Well, delivery times are growing. Now we are booked until 2027. But '28 already has a good order book. And if I remember correctly, 21 gigawatts of reservations is what we currently have. So yes, we have customers who are interested.

And at the same time, in the coming year and then also in '27, we are going to see our capacities enlargements here. So we're trying to balance our operations well. But what this means is we're in a good situation. Our planning horizon is very stable.

[Tim Proll-Gerwe, executive]

Okay. Next question will be in English. Plechinger from EnergyWatch. So Christian, you need to answer in English, but please, Maz, fire your question.

[Maz Plechinger]

I didn't get the last part, Tim, but you're welcome to answer in Danish as well. But I have a few questions about Siemens Gamesa.

One is regarding tariffs, you mentioned mid-double-digit euro effects, why is that? And which projects to -- is sort of Virginia Senator talked that -- talked about that they would have to pay around EUR 300 million in tariffs. Is it project like those which have something in the contract that make you pay tariffs? That's one question.

The other is regarding the onshore successor of the 5.X platform rather than a relaunch. Why is this a successor and? How much is this, indeed, a new platform? And also, when do you expect sales to pick up?

[Christian Bruch, executive]

I probably do it in English. It's probably better for the rest. Yes, first of all, the tariffs, it's a mixed picture. Keep in mind, we have service, onshore and also offshore execution at the moment in the U.S. And there's obviously also tariffs on steel, which is an element. So it's not just European Union and the U.S. So it's a mixed bag of these different things.

Service is mainly local, right? I mean, that is something where there's the least impact between offshore and obviously some pieces of the onshore businesses where we import that is what's driving the impact.

And on the successor, that's a super question. It will not be in the market under 5.X It will have a different -- we call it 7.0, right? So it shows you it's somewhere between a progression of the old platform and really some revised elements. However, let's say, obviously, we base it on things which have worked and which we know. And we also obviously keep a prototype running while we start gradually to introduce the product.

But it is definitely not just 5.X with fixes. It's really a renewed product. However, obviously, based mainly on the same frameworks. But I think the team did a great job to really redesign it. And it gives me a comfort that this can be a successful platform in the market.

[Tim Proll-Gerwe, executive]

[Interpreted] Next question comes from Markus Frühauf from FAZ.

[Markus Frühauf]

[Interpreted] I hope you can all hear me?

[Tim Proll-Gerwe, executive]

[Interpreted] Yes. We hear you well.

[Markus Frühauf]

[Interpreted] Now I'd like to talk about your dividends because you said you talked about the early possibility to pay dividends then. Now Ms. Ferraro earlier said 40% to 60% of net earnings are to be distributed. Is that also true for this year because you had a EUR 3 billion net profit? But with Siemens India, you had special effect, it would be EUR 1.5 billion. So what will be your reference for the dividend payment?

And then I also have a question on the weak dollar. Now EUR 4 billion of negative FX, we heard, if I understand that correctly. But how much is really the weak dollar weighing on your business and what that really means?

[Maria Ferraro, executive]

Yes. I will absolutely go first. Thank you for the questions. And yes, let me clarify the dividend. So the 40% to 60% is based on net income and the technical term is attributable to shareholders.

And yes, that would be the range that we use also for this year and that would be the proposal that we -- would be put forward with that range for a dividend payment. But again, what I wanted to stress is it's for fiscal year '25, but of course, would only be paid after in February '26 onwards after the AGM approval. So that is the basis. So you're correct there.

With respect to the EUR 4 billion of FX, maybe let me clarify. That was relating to a translation effect in our order backlog. So in other words, our order backlog stands at EUR 136 billion. Actually, if it wasn't for that translation effect, we would be closer to the EUR 140 billion. So it did have an effect.

But again, that's temporary in nature. It's something that we do every period. That's why it's called a cumulative translation effect. And of course, that then would vary with the changes in the FX.

What I do want to say is, with respect to profit, right, again, it's important to note that we are hedged. This is something that we do very methodically, especially for our projects. So with respect to profit, we are heavily hedged to ensure that we don't have that variability on a month-by-month or quarter-by-quarter basis.

[Tim Proll-Gerwe, executive]

And the question about the respective dividend. Important to Siemens Energy, not India, right?

[Maria Ferraro, executive]

Of course, yes, if that was what was asked, yes, absolutely. So it would be the Siemens Energy net income effect. I think what they were referring to is the special effect of EUR 473 million. That is deemed a special effect. So of course, it would be excluding that or could be excluding that profit because it's a noncash effect, to be technical. Yes, thanks.

[Tim Proll-Gerwe, executive]

[Interpreted] Mr. Bruch, he also asked the question about why you have the dividend ban that you've -- to not release just the dividend, that no longer a ban on the dividend.

[Christian Bruch, executive]

[Interpreted] That's a nice question. Well, okay. Let me try and give you the answer the ban on paying out a dividend was really a major problem for our investors. And in the next calendar year or the next fiscal year, the ban on the bonus will also be lifted. But for this calendar year -- sorry, for this fiscal year, I should put it, that is still the way it is.

[Tim Proll-Gerwe, executive]

[Interpreted] The next question is Christof Ruhrmair from dpa.

[Christof Ruhrmair]

[Interpreted] I would like to know -- this is a question of the strong position and high new orders. So you have a very important and strong position on the market. How much does this influence the prices? So can you ask for better prices, considering the high demand? How much does that amount to?

And then another request. Could you really tell us what about the EUR 1 billion -- or up to EUR 1 billion organically in operations in terms of profit, how much of this close to EUR 0.5 billion can be added -- considered for India? And I assume that in this current fiscal year, you will be above last year's, especially driven by special items? Or is that being far too speculative?

[Christian Bruch, executive]

[Interpreted] Well, let me say something on the prices and you can -- Maria can talk about the net income.

Well, let me put it this way, generically speaking, in all areas, the orders that we take in, these are accretive to the backlog margin. In other words, profitability in the backlog is increased. So everything that we see in the prices is higher than the average. And this is based on the price increases during the quarter.

And then we have been able to say that what we see now in Gas Turbines, we continue to have a situation where price increases can be achieved, but not to the same extent as was the case in previous years -- or in previous quarters. The price curve is flattening out.

The similar situation in Grid Technologies, this as in Gas, depends on the delivery dates.

We also have to say if you have a short-term delivery and then you can enforce high price increases, but if it's an order that will not go through until '28 or '29, then that's not the case. And you have to see it that way.

But I think the most important message here is that everything that we take on board can increase the profitability of the backlog. In other words, the average profitability is improved as a result.

[Maria Ferraro, executive]

Let me take then the dividend question, let me clarify again. So you're fully right. Our guidance says around EUR 1 billion in net income for this fiscal year for Siemens Energy and we excluded in that guidance a special effect coming from the demerger of the Siemens Energy India Limited. We now know this quarter that, that effect is approximately EUR 0.5 billion. So we still maintain the EUR 1 billion and we don't include that in our guidance, right? But of course, the net income, including that impact is exactly right, it's about the EUR 1.5 billion, all in.

So just 2 topics there with respect to what would we consider with respect to the dividend. Our dividend policy does indicate that, of course, we can exclude noncash items. And to be very clear, the Siemens Energy India Limited, let's say, translation effect is a positive effect, but it's noncash in nature. It's really a technical accounting treatment effect, and hence, why we excluded it from our guidance accordingly.

But again, our policy does indicate that we can exclude noncash items. But what I would ask is that we finish the fiscal year, determine how our net income fares and then we go from there. Yes. Hopefully, that clarifies that.

[Tim Proll-Gerwe, executive]

[Interpreted] Thank you very much. [Operator Instructions] We have 2 more questions in the chat. Mr. Bruch, a question from Ed Ballard from Wall Street Journal. Let me read it out to in English and maybe you can answer in English.

Administration indicated to Siemens Energy that additional manufacturing capacity for gas turbines would be desirable given the strength of demand growth.

[Christian Bruch, executive]

Yes. First of all, it's -- first of all, it's ourselves or the Trump administration seeing the good markets. So as I said, we have an interest to expand our production capacity in the U.S. And for the transformers, switchgears, we are doing it at the moment for the blade factory in Florida. We are doing this at the moment.

We are exploring further opportunities. What we are trying to balance out is also the understanding what does the investment cost. You see the inflation in the construction market. Obviously, building a factory gets more and more expensive. And we obviously try to understand what is really the long-term trajectory of the market going forward in the U.S.

We are in close contact also with the administration. Keep in mind, in a lot of cases, the state is even more relevant than the federal government. But obviously, what is an interest, and I myself has been in Washington lately, is are we able really to ensure the supremacy in artificial intelligence by supplying the electricity. And absolutely, we are interested to contribute where we can and ensure that the U.S. is successful on their journey.

And in that regard, we continue to look into this and also discuss with the states and with the federal government in terms of how do they look on it, particular since the data center infrastructure is obviously linked also to certain federal decisions in terms of what comes when.

So we are in contact. But I really want to underline that it's really market-driven for us from the customers. And we will continue to look on to further investments in the U.S., but we are on it already.

[Tim Proll-Gerwe, executive]

[Interpreted] Next question from the chat is from Joachim Herr of Borsen-Zeitung. Mr. Bruch, you said before that tariffs are mostly affecting existing long-term service contracts. Now I don't know if Maria or Christian wants to take that. What are the effects of U.S. import tariffs in the coming years once those long-term service contracts expire?

[Christian Bruch, executive]

[Interpreted] Well, first of all, tariffs affect everything, okay. But the question is how much of it can we pass on to our customers or not. So in that context, I do believe that tariffs will lead to a change in pricing structure. You're going to see higher prices, also because our competitors are exactly in the same situation here.

Now the question is, will you do more localization or not will very much hinge on how much you can plan the situation and how long term that situation. No one, no one is going to build a factory for the market in the next 3 or 4 years, right?

So investments into a manufacturing facility are massive. So therefore, you need to have a feeling how the market develops over the next 10 years. So that's really what matters. So in that context, it's true that we're very much preoccupied with the tariff situation.

I'd like to call on everyone. Stay calm, look at the market, try to understand the underlying trends. That will be what matters most.

[Tim Proll-Gerwe, executive]

[Interpreted] Thank you very much. [indiscernible] has a follow-up question.

[Unknown Attendee]

[Interpreted] A follow-up question on Gas Services. Now I've seen that your target was that by 2030, your gas emissions -- or Gas Services emissions are to be reduced by 1/3. Is your climate targets still up to date? And if it is up to date, how do you want to achieve that while you at the same time are growing your orders and you grow your capacities in Gas Services? How do you stick to your target?

[Christian Bruch, executive]

[Interpreted] Well, Scope 3 referred to the entire company. So let me say that at the top. And it depends on how much customers switch to other fuels, right? I mean, that's what it was about them. If you're operating a gas turbine, you can fire it with hydrogen.

So this is why it's not that we have control on our own. Now obviously, we're looking at the situation as we speak. And of course, it will be influenced by growth going forward.

But again, let us also point out it doesn't depend on how we are developing, but how the customer market is developing. And if or when society is ready to invest into alternative fuels, countries will have to spend money on that. And this is something that is discussed across the board now.

It's the truth of the matter that in any electricity system, you need dispatchable power. Dispatchable power means you can control flexibly the need and you can use a gas turbine, whether it takes natural gas or hydrogen is your decision. So we cannot resolve that on our own.

In that sense, I cannot give you a final answer. We're trying to understand the market drivers as we see them out there. What is important for me is that at the end of the day, everything is a Scope 1 emission. So everything that we do. Scope 3 refers to the investments carried out by others, not by us.

So therefore, we will stick with our road map to reduce our Scope 1 and Scope 2 emissions and to achieve net zero emissions by 2030 that we're striving for. That's my corridor, right? That's what I can influence. Looking at what the market does is hard for us to influence.

[Tim Proll-Gerwe, executive]

Maz Plechinger from EnergyWatch.

[Maz Plechinger]

Thank you for adding more details on the new onshore turbine. But could I get you to elaborate a bit more on its market potential, more specifically in the German market? So how much of a difference do you assume that this turbine can make in the German market before the current boom begins to fade?

[Christian Bruch, executive]

Yes, once again, an excellent question. I will probably better able to tell you 6 months from now when I have seen really the sales teams having developed or starting to develop projects with the customers. What I hear from the, let's say, early discussions and prediscussions, which we had with customers, across Germany, also across Northern Europe, also in areas you could consider like Australia is a very positive reception in terms of high interest of customers in this turbine. Whether they order the turbine at the end, it's something where I really would like to see the proof points first from the market. And I really have to say, I cannot tell you at this point in time. But I think the product itself is well positioned.

And now we have to see how the customers are taking it up in the current environment. And obviously, yes, we would love to happen to the German market as well. But as you know, project development in the German market takes particular long because of the process on how it is. So I would not expect that Germany is the first market what we see while taking in orders.

[Tim Proll-Gerwe, executive]

[Interpreted] So all the questions have been answered. We've learned that Mr. Bruch speaks Danish as well. So we can conclude today's press call.

Thank you for joining us and for your interest. If you have any follow-up questions, my press team and myself will be happy to hear from you by phone.

The conference call for analysts with Christian Bruch and Maria Ferraro will begin at 10:30 this morning. You can dial in if you like, but you can't ask questions. That's only for analysts. You can find the link on our website.

The next date is our annual press conference. The year has gone by quickly. It will be on the 14th of November in Berlin, and we'll send you out a save the date in the near future.

So thank you all very much. That concludes today's conference call, and have a lovely day. Thank you very much.

[Portions of this transcript that are marked [Interpreted] were spoken by an interpreter present on the live call.]